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post #1 of 19 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 01:40 PM Thread Starter
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Streetable 429

Hey guys, seems like anytime I tell someone that I'm putting a 429 in my ranger, the same question comes up: Why not a 460 or a bigger stroker? A big block in a ranger is gonna give me more useable power than I'll ever need, even with a 429. Plus I want to actually try to get "decent" mileage. So with the low weight of a ranger, I don't see why I need a bigger engine. So here's my question... Will a 460 deliver equivalent mileage to a 429? A local engine builder told me the increased stroke will cause an increase in port velocity which will lead to better atomization and therefore better efficiency. It kind of makes sense, but I think about on the highway there really isn't much load, so the extra cubic inches should chew up more fuel right?

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post #2 of 19 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 01:56 PM
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Now this is just me..... But if I ever wanted to get any kind of mpg out of a motor, i definitely would not buy a big block of any kind. You should have thrown something like mileage out the window as soon as you started thinking about more cubes. But thats just me.....

if this helps at all a 429 is the same as a 460 but with a different crank and pistons.....
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post #3 of 19 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 02:03 PM Thread Starter
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Hehehe, well I'm not expecting to get great mileage, but just as good as I can get it. I fully understand mileage is a relative term when it comes to these things.

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post #4 of 19 (permalink) Old 12-22-2009, 09:15 AM
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How much power is more than you will ever need?

What other goals do you have besides decent gas mileage?

I had a 429 with a solid cam and stealth intake run 12.50"s at 106 mph. It was a little slow since it had exhaust manifolds with 2.5" turbo mufflers to the rear bumber, and a 2600 rpm converter. But on the street, it would barely spin the tires in first gear, and it just felt like a healthy small block. Now I have a 501 in it that runs 10.60's in street trim. With 31x14.5x15 et streets, it only spins in first gear.
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post #5 of 19 (permalink) Old 12-22-2009, 11:03 AM
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429 and gas milage, there's a conflict of interests if ever I've heard one!

As far as milage goes, I'd always err towards the smaller engine. Like you said, even a 429 is going to make WAY more power than you'll really be able to use on the street.

If you want mileage, drop in a small block. My brother dropped a mild 302 into a ranger in high school w/ an AOD and it would get mid 20's on the highway. Even w/ us lead foots driving it it would average 15+mpg. That truck was a lot of fun and would burn the tires all the way THROUGH 4th gear! My brother actually got the torque converter to lock in 4th w/ the tires still a blazin'

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post #6 of 19 (permalink) Old 12-22-2009, 11:56 AM
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I had a bonestock 460 in my 83 t-bird and got 17mpg I delivered pizzas with this car for over a year and was getting better mileage than the other drivers with there beat up 4-bangers. I had a 3310 holley with 70 jets in the front and the stock secondary spring in it and dual 2 1/4 inch exhaust with some dynomax turbo mufflers. As long as I didnt beat the snot out of it I got that mileage now when I opened it up it was a whole other story. With the right gearing and keeping it tuned up you can have your cake and eat it too. I had a factory 3.08 with a posi in it and 26 inch tall factory style tires. I believe there is the ability to get a good power to weight ratio and optimize gas mileage. The ranger is very close to the weight of a mustang of the same era.
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post #7 of 19 (permalink) Old 12-22-2009, 08:51 PM Thread Starter
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Well my intention is a fun truck that can get decent mileage. A 429 in a ranger is gonna be fun no matter what, but if I can get 15mpg out of it, then I'll already be getting better mileage than my old 4.0L ranger. A local engine builder looked over some of my stuff and told me 15MPG should be easy and he would estimate close to 20, except I have a 6" lift. It's still a lot lower than my buddy's stock 2004 F150. I can have a 460 crank for a case of beer, but I think I'm gonna stick with a 429. If I ever want a stroker I'll build a real one to drop in. The truck will already be set up for it.

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post #8 of 19 (permalink) Old 12-22-2009, 09:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by t120r View Post
Well my intention is a fun truck that can get decent mileage. A 429 in a ranger is gonna be fun no matter what, but if I can get 15mpg out of it, then I'll already be getting better mileage than my old 4.0L ranger. A local engine builder looked over some of my stuff and told me 15MPG should be easy and he would estimate close to 20, except I have a 6" lift. It's still a lot lower than my buddy's stock 2004 F150. I can have a 460 crank for a case of beer, but I think I'm gonna stick with a 429. If I ever want a stroker I'll build a real one to drop in. The truck will already be set up for it.
If you need to replace your pistons, you might want to re-think that beer trade for the 460 crank, as it will open up a whole different piston choice over the 429 options. Other than that, I think the 429 would be a fine choice.

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post #9 of 19 (permalink) Old 12-22-2009, 09:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by t120r View Post
Well my intention is a fun truck that can get decent mileage. A 429 in a ranger is gonna be fun no matter what, but if I can get 15mpg out of it, then I'll already be getting better mileage than my old 4.0L ranger. A local engine builder looked over some of my stuff and told me 15MPG should be easy and he would estimate close to 20, except I have a 6" lift. It's still a lot lower than my buddy's stock 2004 F150. I can have a 460 crank for a case of beer, but I think I'm gonna stick with a 429. If I ever want a stroker I'll build a real one to drop in. The truck will already be set up for it.

Is it two wheel drive and what size tires are you using?
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post #10 of 19 (permalink) Old 12-22-2009, 11:17 PM
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t120,

There are so many variables to what you are asking. Yes, the 429 should get the best mileage but, how the engine is tuned and geared will affect that greatly. If mileage is a concern, a standard trans helps. How you get the distributor vacuum advance set-up, which takes some work, will also greatly affect mileage.

IMHO, for what you are doing, a 429 is plenty. Something like this would give you a lot of power and give good gas mileage, if you keep your foot out of it :

Intake System:

Holley 3310 vacuum secondary
Edelbrock Performer (non-RPM) Intake Manifold

Cylinder Heads:

D3VE budget ported from RHP
Chambers polished
Stock rockers.

Short Block:

Lunati 61600 cam http://www.lunatipower.com/Product.aspx?id=1678&gid=287
KB368 Flat top pistons, .010 above deck
Stock crank
Stock rods
Standard volume oil pump
Stock oil pan

Exhaust:

Ported passenger cast-iron manifolds to dual 2.5" pipes with H-pipe. Good flowing 2.5" Magnaflow mufflers or equivalent.

Hope that helps,

Dave
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post #11 of 19 (permalink) Old 12-23-2009, 01:01 AM Thread Starter
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My truck is an SAS'd 4x4. Axles from a '79 bronco with 3.55:1 and 31" tires to make it look half normal. I'll try and get some pics this week to post up. As for the pistons, I have to buy some with the SCJ valve relief anyway, so it's just $60 for the pin change to a 429. No biggie.

That engine combo would be pretty stout, but it's a little different than what I have in mind. Here's what I have in boxes right now:

Intake system:

NOS EFI Throttle Body
Ford Motorsports H429 Intake Manifold

Ignition:

Individual LS1 coils from an Avalanche

EEC/Fuel System:

AEM EMS with dual wideband controller
AEM IAT, CTS, 3.5 Bar Map, AEM Wideband HEGO Sensors
Walbro 255lph fuel tank
FMS 42lb/hr green top injectors
Aeromotive Filter & FPR

Cylinder Heads:

M-6049-SCJ Heads (chambers mirror polished and edges radiused)
Comp Roller Rockers

Short Block:

Comp XE274H Cam & Lifters (probably too much cam)
Stock Crank
High Flow Dynamic's HV Oil Pump
Moroso 8qt rear sump 4x4 pan

Exhaust:

Custom headers made by Bigblockranger (Thanks again)
dual 2 1/2" magnaflow mufflers

Transmission:

ZF 5-Speed
BW1356 Transfer Case

I basically need an AEM EPM for the computer, a set of rods and pistons. Not sure on the compression ratio, but I'm thinking on flat tops which will bring me around 11:1. In a Newfoundland climate, lightweight truck... Should run on pump gas. Only time will tell. I'm not trying to reinvent the wheel, but I love trying different things. I'm just really curious as to what to expect from this. Basically cause of the time of year all me and my friends can do is "gab" about it. Be a few months before I can get it installed. As everything is still in boxes, feel free to give me any suggestions.

T120r

Last edited by t120r; 12-23-2009 at 01:08 AM.
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post #12 of 19 (permalink) Old 12-23-2009, 07:18 PM
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LOL.

You're building 550+ hp and you're worrying about gas mileage?

IMHO, you'll be better off with a solid flat tappet. That combo will want to wind to 7k no problem, and the solid will be well ahead at that point. You're not really building for gas mileage at all, so it is going to be what it is. Be expecting as bad as 4-5 miles per gallon when you're on it all the time.

Dave
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post #13 of 19 (permalink) Old 12-23-2009, 07:53 PM
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"Streetable" is a personally relative term...!

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post #14 of 19 (permalink) Old 12-23-2009, 09:59 PM Thread Starter
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Yes, streetable is a relative term.

The engine came out of a '71 lincoln. Compression was rated at 11:1 stock and the 6500lb car supposedly got 17mpg. At least that's what the net told me. The intake is a bit big, but I've read a single plane works better for EFI and doesn't suffer from signal loss the same way a carb motor does. The big question for me is the cam. I probably should have picked a different one, but I got it so cheap. I may end up changing it out for another one. I realize that if I keep my foot into it, I'll need a 5th wheel with a tanker behind me, but on the highway cruising with an overdrive and SEFI, it shouldn't be tooooo bad I don't think. Then again, I'm probably just driving myself crazy thinking about it until I actually bolt it all together.

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post #15 of 19 (permalink) Old 12-24-2009, 10:11 AM
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It's not the size of the motor that determines mileage as much as how much HP you are feeding and the weight and aerodynamics of your car. A giant motor cruising at a low rpm with the throttle barely tipped in would do better than a tiny 4cyl screaming on the mat just to keep up with traffic. That's how 400hp Vettes get 30mpg.
The 429 vs. 460 crank difference would be negligable for mpg. Although mileage would never be impressive with your truck, you would see improvements through spot-on tuning and driving habits.
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