The ol' "Guess my Horsepower" game - 460 Ford Forum
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post #1 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-13-2017, 10:02 PM Thread Starter
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The ol' "Guess my Horsepower" game

just closing up my build. will be in a chassis dyno within 30 days.

I thought itd be fun to put out the build list, and see where we all fall. Please post a reply, as this is no fun without it.
IF ANYONE HAS A DESKTOP DYNO, PLEASE RUN THIS AND LET ME KNOW WHAT YOU GET AND WHAT PROGRAM YOURE USING
fun to see if theyre close

87 block
.060 over@4.420" all balanced
3.85 stroke
22cc dish forged pistons
.035 below deck
D0ve 75cc heads with the best porting job ive ever seen,( built a dozen small blocks) gasket matched, 2.25"/1.75" valves
roller tip rockers
comp cams 270H
UPC: 036584520306
Cam Style: Hydraulic flat tappet
Basic Operating RPM Range: 1,800-5,800
Intake Duration at 050 inch Lift: 224
Exhaust Duration at 050 inch Lift: 224
Duration at 050 inch Lift: 224 int./224 exh.
Advertised Intake Duration: 270
Advertised Exhaust Duration: 270
Advertised Duration: 270 int./270 exh.
Intake Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio: 0.519 in.
Exhaust Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio: 0.519 in.
Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio: 0.519 int./0.519 exh.
Lobe Separation (degrees): 110
Computer-Controlled Compatible: No
Grind Number: FF 270H-10
.042" gasket
straight up timing @ abotut 32deg.
Shorty LnL headers
weiand 8021 , dual plane high rise intake
Street demon 650 carb
msd6al ignition kit
v belts powering the 100amp alt, power steering, and fan.
carb and timing will be tuned throughout the dyno day, with a professional

c6 tranny with shift kit and 3.55 gears on 33x12.5 under a 77 f150
I have a lot of extra parts left, including another cam which has a better exhaust side, but I like the numbers i was given on the comp cams thingy with this one...


im guessing 480 but im worried i may not have the compression to get there... at the last minute I went for 9.28 instead of 9.6

Last edited by trident450; 04-13-2017 at 10:14 PM.
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post #2 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 12:23 AM
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MMMMMM...........340-360hp @ the rear tires.

Cheers, Bob
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post #3 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 08:20 AM
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Guessing aboout the same, good carb and a performer intake and it will be fun to drive.
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post #4 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 09:09 AM
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Your camshaft choice is not one I would make.
Farm likes this.
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post #5 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 10:32 AM
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I'm not a pro engine-builder. But I think you are making some of the same mistakes I made on my first build.
Since this is a truck (heavy) you want to build for torque (forget HP numbers). IMO.

1) The truck would be happier with a cam like 216I/224E duration at .050". (split duration favoring exhaust, with not as much duration on intake).
Something like the 262 series 34-235-4 - Xtreme 4 x 4? Hydraulic Flat Tappet Camshafts

2) You would better off with the Edelbrock Performer intake over the Stealth.

3) the carb is small, a 750cfm would be a better match.

4) The tires are a little tall for that gearing. Maybe okay. My truck had 3.54 gears and 29" tires (stock) and when I switched to 33", and I felt a real drop in performance.

*
1982 F-250 XLT 4x4, 5800lbs, C6-BW1345, 466 cid, 9.5:1, TFS290 PowerPort heads, Crane Hyd Roller Cam (278/286 adv., 216/224 @.050), Edelbrock Performer, Hedman headers, QFT HR-780VS, MSD6A and Billet dist., NOS Cheater system, 4.56 gearing, 7" lift, 37" tires.

Last edited by 4604X4; 04-14-2017 at 11:20 AM.
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post #6 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 11:12 AM
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Cool

What type of chassis dyno?

Inertial single roller?
Dual roller eddy?
Mustang dyno?

The different types of chassis dynos will show vastly different numbers on the same combination same day. Hell tire pressure and weight is another significant variable.


Single pattern cam is killing you. Get RID of it !!!
Carb is small. 750 is more appropriate.
Leaving pistons 30 in the hole bad idea...


300ish on an inertial dyno as is.

Up to the 500 hp mark one does not even need to touch the intake port entry. The focus is in the bowl area(s) with in 1.5" of the valve.
Gasket matching creates a bell mouth that hurts port velocity and torque. I have the dyno sheet to prove this.

I've had beautiful port work come into the shop with large valves etc that did not flow as well as our budget oriented 2.11" / 1.65" iron heads. Flowing them would be a good idea.




S

Scotty J. "AKA" The "Mad Porter"
"EMC 2006" 3rd place finisher
Ported BBF iron head specialist & Aluminum heads from all sources.
Custom ground cams
See our products in the Vendor for sale section
Customized crate engines
http://R-H-P.biz

"ReinCarNation High Performance" (253)-988-6648


http://www.facebook.com/SMJRHP#!/SMJRHP

Last edited by The Mad Porter; 04-14-2017 at 04:32 PM. Reason: Spelling
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post #7 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 01:19 PM
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I think you're going to be about 380 at the crank, so whatever kind of chassis dyno you're using, I think the math will add up to that.
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post #8 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 01:23 PM
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I think an easy way to put the low numbers you're seeing guessed......Your heads may be beautifully and well done, but you haven't got the carb or camshaft to take advantage of them.

Lucas
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post #9 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 02:47 PM Thread Starter
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Well, ive got a classic holley 750 as well, that im bringing- but Ive heard rumors of better throttle response with the smaller carbs at normal driving rpms. This is one of the tests ive been hoping to perform while on the dyno, which is a mustang btw.

The other cam I have is a 264 comp cams. But the reason im using the 270 is because the "camquest" showed it delivering the best torque numbers.

well ****. I want this to work well, so should i go back to my edelbrock performer 460 intake?
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post #10 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 03:15 PM
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I think the other guys were being generous. With this combo I'll say 320 HP to the rear wheels.

If the motor isn't together yet you really need to rethink this build as the others have said. It is going to run like a 3 legged dog with that high rise intake & cam combination. Let the Madd Porter set you up with a custom grind cam for your combo & get a different intake & carb for it. You will be glad you did when done. After reading your parts list you are in for a disappointment if you don't change direction with this build.

Send Questions To: Chris@MrScharfenberger.com
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post #11 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 03:52 PM Thread Starter
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ok, so after work ill match up and install my performer 460 intake, and my 750.

Im looking to use an off the shelf cam, though i understand it to not be as ideal. Looks like the xe274h will give me the desired exhaust numbers to get me some much better flow. Any other cams that y'all recommend?
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post #12 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 03:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trident450 View Post
ok, so after work ill match up and install my performer 460 intake, and my 750.

Im looking to use an off the shelf cam, though i understand it to not be as ideal. Looks like the xe274h will give me the desired exhaust numbers to get me some much better flow. Any other cams that y'all recommend?
A custom grind is really only like $50 more than an off the shelf (sorry if I'm misquoting that, Scotty). It will be made for your car, with your gear ratios, with your transmission, for what type of driving you want to do. Do yourself a favor, and just get a custom one made, so you don't have to put a 3rd cam in it. You've made one camshaft mistake, don't do another....Not trying to be rude, but it'll be so much better.

Lucas
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post #13 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 03:56 PM
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And, it's pretty cool to tell everyone you've got a custom grind made
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post #14 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 04:49 PM
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Cool

We do a 9.8 to 10 to 1 crate combo that makes 545 to 555 Tq and 460 hp.
Cam is modest. Custom ground Voodoo 219 / 233 @ .050" ($249.94 for cam and lifters) About the same as a comp cam and high energy lifters.
Remember that the factory cam has 13 additional exhaust degrees timing.

Here is a link to our FB page album outlining the combo. Feel free to use as a guide.

Performer intake and jomar power cone. NO need to touch the intake if you are looking for good average torque.

https://www.facebook.com/pg/SMJRHP/p...77556022331783


RPM intake, 10.2 to 1 static c/r and 227 / 241 cam gets you about 500 hp. 1" 4 hole spacer will put it over 500.


https://www.facebook.com/pg/SMJRHP/p...14530205301031


Going with the Xe274H will raise your powerband similarly to the combo above but make less power due to shorter exhaust timing. Every crate combo we build is at or near 0 deck height. Some lower rpm towing combos are .005" out. Decking your block to get your pistons near deck height will pay large dividends in both torque and octane tolerance.



S

Scotty J. "AKA" The "Mad Porter"
"EMC 2006" 3rd place finisher
Ported BBF iron head specialist & Aluminum heads from all sources.
Custom ground cams
See our products in the Vendor for sale section
Customized crate engines
http://R-H-P.biz

"ReinCarNation High Performance" (253)-988-6648


http://www.facebook.com/SMJRHP#!/SMJRHP
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post #15 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-14-2017, 06:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trident450 View Post
ok, so after work ill match up and install my performer 460 intake, and my 750.

Im looking to use an off the shelf cam, though i understand it to not be as ideal. Looks like the xe274h will give me the desired exhaust numbers to get me some much better flow. Any other cams that y'all recommend?
Yes.. Call Scotty (The Mad Porter) and get a custom grind cam and quit screwing around. You already have a fair amount of money into this project I'm sure. Drop another $50 bucks or so and get something that will REALLY WORK WELL. Why pick an off the shelf cam that is nothing but a compromise for a lot of motors combined? Also get your two intakes on the Auction Block and when they sell buy a Edelbrock Performer RPM intake.

Here is a video of my old Bronco with the Edelbrock Performer RPM package on it. All the parts matched and the combo worked well together.

Send Questions To: Chris@MrScharfenberger.com
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