460 build advice needed. - 460 Ford Forum
Engine Tech A place to discuss all 385-series engine tech and theory.

User Tag List

 20Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
post #1 of 78 (permalink) Old 04-28-2017, 07:14 AM Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 68
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 28 Post(s)
 
460 build advice needed.

Hey fellas, new here. Hope y'all don't mind helping out a guy with no real experience. I've rebuilt a farmall m engine as an adult, and done some minor engine surgeries as a teen. I'm mechanically inclined, jut inexperienced. Lot of terms I don't know, some I do and some I may understand but not know how to execute.

I've got to get some specialty tools together such as dwell meter, timing light, bore scope, stuff like that.

I've always wanted to play with theses engines and finally have come to a point where financially I can....a little. Got four kids so don't have a mill to throw at it, but a few dollars.

What I've got and got in mind....

I have a d9te-da engine, guy insists it's a 429... my research says 460. Will check crank when it arrives. It is a fresh overhaul, .030 over. My plan at the moment is to use the bottom end and purchase all new parts for top end. I want some narly power, and the parts will need to be suitable for later when I stroke it out to 554cubes or so.

So, parts I need some advice on....

-heads, I'm prepared to spend a little here
-intake, want something that is not all about torque or rpm, in the middle so to speak. Was think victor, but low end will suffer I think
- I will be using a fitech Efi setup, prolly the 800hp single. Was thinking of the dual quad. If you think that is a good idea, let me know, I'll go that route.
-cam, this is where I'm lost without hope. I want a choppy narly idle, just because I love the way it sounds, but if that is not feasible for my build then of course , power and throttle response win.
-some truck headers
-electronic ignition, something adjustable, easy to curve(which I don't understand yet). I'm thinking of something msd, advice welcome on that as well.

That about sums it up. I'm guessing I'll need a higher stall converter as well, maybe 2400rpm?

Tranny will be a c6, gears are 380's.

Thanks for your help.
jdownj likes this.
Fordman1971 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 78 (permalink) Old 04-28-2017, 07:49 AM
Senior Member
 
4604X4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Orlando Florida
Posts: 447
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 42 Post(s)
 
The complication with your plan, IMO, is that the heads, cam, intake/carb for a 554 (future) are not right for a 429 (current) built. Your going to need to compromise somewhere.
What vehicle is this going into (weight, street only, or track only, or street/track use)?
What compression do you want to end up at (i.e. run premium pump gas)?
You mention "truck headers" so I assume you have a PU (2wd or 4wd?).

*
1982 F-250 XLT 4x4, 5800lbs, C6-BW1345, 466 cid, 9.5:1, TFS290 PowerPort heads, Crane Hyd Roller Cam (278/286 adv., 216/224 @.050), Edelbrock Performer, Hedman headers, QFT HR-780VS, MSD6A and Billet dist., NOS Cheater system, 4.56 gearing, 7" lift, 37" tires.
4604X4 is offline  
post #3 of 78 (permalink) Old 04-28-2017, 07:59 AM Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 68
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 28 Post(s)
 
Thank you for your reply 460,
It is going in a 71 f250 2wd. I use this truck currently as my runaround truck. I love this old truck. Mainly I want it to be driveable. Hmmm, ok, I read about driveability, or street manners, I don't quite understand what that means besides the obvious. So, I need awesome lowend response, good rpm....really I'm shooting for 600hp from this stock bottom end that is fun to drive.

I was afraid of the components compatibility between stroker and unstroked. I'm looking at 9.5 to 10:1 CR so I can run pump. If I go with a nice set of ported aluminum heads, they should be fine to use with the stroker, then I can change intake and cam to suit the stroker...is this a good train of thought?

Last edited by Fordman1971; 04-28-2017 at 08:04 AM.
Fordman1971 is offline  
 
post #4 of 78 (permalink) Old 04-28-2017, 09:03 AM
Senior Member
 
4604X4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Orlando Florida
Posts: 447
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 42 Post(s)
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fordman1971 View Post
Thank you for your reply 460,
It is going in a 71 f250 2wd. I use this truck currently as my runaround truck. I love this old truck. Mainly I want it to be driveable. Hmmm, ok, I read about driveability, or street manners, I don't quite understand what that means besides the obvious. So, I need awesome lowend response, good rpm....really I'm shooting for 600hp from this stock bottom end that is fun to drive.

I was afraid of the components compatibility between stroker and unstroked. I'm looking at 9.5 to 10:1 CR so I can run pump. If I go with a nice set of ported aluminum heads, they should be fine to use with the stroker, then I can change intake and cam to suit the stroker...is this a good train of thought?
Wait for some of the professional builders to reply. Then look at some of builds they do for their customers with similar goals.
Mad Porter usually shares his builds.

For what you want (600HP) I think you can get that with a 460 (stock crank) and some good aftermarket heads and cam. I don't think you need to spend the money on Stroker crank. IMO, 500-550HP is about the threshold for an engine with good street manners - above that you give up idle vacuum (nice to have for power brakes) and mild street manners - and you start getting into the temperamental, adrenaline pumping, not-a-daily-driver build (which is hard not to love).

What piston is in the engine now (dished, flat top, etc.)?

*
1982 F-250 XLT 4x4, 5800lbs, C6-BW1345, 466 cid, 9.5:1, TFS290 PowerPort heads, Crane Hyd Roller Cam (278/286 adv., 216/224 @.050), Edelbrock Performer, Hedman headers, QFT HR-780VS, MSD6A and Billet dist., NOS Cheater system, 4.56 gearing, 7" lift, 37" tires.

Last edited by 4604X4; 04-28-2017 at 09:15 AM.
4604X4 is offline  
post #5 of 78 (permalink) Old 04-28-2017, 09:21 AM Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 68
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 28 Post(s)
 
I hadn't gotten it yet, still in transport. When it gets here I'll jerk the heads off, check pistons and measure down hole.

I was reading up on the Kaase' p-51 heads, I like what I'm reading there. Might be my choice, 400cfm intake flow is rediculous!
Fordman1971 is offline  
post #6 of 78 (permalink) Old 04-28-2017, 10:51 AM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,039
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 81 Post(s)
 
Your better off with the entry level AFR heads................with 528ci ...10-1 comp...224/230 560 lift hydraulic flat tappet will make over 600hp/650tq with ease.

Cheers, Bob
bob460 is offline  
post #7 of 78 (permalink) Old 04-28-2017, 11:06 AM
Senior Member
 
CarsByCarl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Colorado Springs, CO.
Posts: 5,249
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 103 Post(s)
 
Garage
Lopey cams and EFI don't go together well.

Piston selection is going to be limited for an AFR/SCJ/P51 headed 429 or 460, but we can have pistons made for them, or you can fly-cut pretty much any piston with an in-head fly cutter.

Simple combo that will make a very street friendly ~600 HP and TQ in a 460:
AFR 280cc/75cc heads
Permormer RPM intake
Lunati 10340102 cam
460 bottom end with stock -22cc pistons

You could also use an Edebrock head, but count on about 50HP less power, and you're still going to have to either use a new piston, or clearance the old pistons for radial clearance on the valves.

.

Your one stop shop for BBF engines and parts
Master dealer for Lunati and Diamond
Warehouse distributor for AFR, Racetec, Quickfuel, Holley, Edelbrock, Phenix, and most other speed parts

Last edited by CarsByCarl; 04-28-2017 at 11:11 AM.
CarsByCarl is online now  
post #8 of 78 (permalink) Old 04-28-2017, 11:47 AM Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 68
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 28 Post(s)
 
Awesome info, thx fellas.

Who makes the AFR's? That build list you listed Carl, will efi be ok with the lunati cam you speced?

Ok, sorry for asking that. I googled it. These heads require a certain piston, or flycutting the current pistons. Was trying not to do any machine work on my first go around. Although, the p-51 heads may require it also, not sure.

I can fly cut my own pistons, I'm game for that....google here I come. I reread your post Carl, it leads me to believe I can do this.

Last edited by Fordman1971; 04-28-2017 at 12:00 PM.
Fordman1971 is offline  
post #9 of 78 (permalink) Old 04-28-2017, 11:54 AM
Senior Member
 
CarsByCarl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Colorado Springs, CO.
Posts: 5,249
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 103 Post(s)
 
Garage
The combo listed should work well with the FiTech EFI.

AFR = Airflow Research. Didn't think about it before, but I have some 460 pistons on clearance that would work in that combo. Take a look at our website and/or facebook page for more info.


.

Your one stop shop for BBF engines and parts
Master dealer for Lunati and Diamond
Warehouse distributor for AFR, Racetec, Quickfuel, Holley, Edelbrock, Phenix, and most other speed parts
CarsByCarl is online now  
post #10 of 78 (permalink) Old 04-28-2017, 12:25 PM Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 68
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 28 Post(s)
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by CarsByCarl View Post
The combo listed should work well with the FiTech EFI.

AFR = Airflow Research. Didn't think about it before, but I have some 460 pistons on clearance that would work in that combo. Take a look at our website and/or facebook page for more info.


.
They are .080 over. Reboring the block is not what I wanted to do....but, if I want the power it's starting to look like this isn't legos and to get it I'm gonna have to go deeper than i anticipated. This is where inexperience raises its ugly head. I'm in though, let me get the engine here, and go from there. I like the price of the afr heads so that is my route for heads. I'm gonna call you Carl, once i get the facts together as to what I've got. Thx for the time.
CarsByCarl likes this.

Last edited by Fordman1971; 04-28-2017 at 12:34 PM.
Fordman1971 is offline  
post #11 of 78 (permalink) Old 04-29-2017, 07:22 AM Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 68
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 28 Post(s)
 
Fordman1971 is offline  
post #12 of 78 (permalink) Old 04-29-2017, 09:40 AM
Senior Member
 
CarsByCarl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Colorado Springs, CO.
Posts: 5,249
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 103 Post(s)
 
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fordman1971 View Post
It's a good intake. More oriented to bigger cubes and/or higher rpm use than the regular RPM. As I recall, it uses a non-CJ gasket, so it should work with the AFR heads just fine.


.

Your one stop shop for BBF engines and parts
Master dealer for Lunati and Diamond
Warehouse distributor for AFR, Racetec, Quickfuel, Holley, Edelbrock, Phenix, and most other speed parts
CarsByCarl is online now  
post #13 of 78 (permalink) Old 04-29-2017, 05:38 PM Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 68
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 28 Post(s)
 
I suppose I could...for now, use this intake, suffer a little on Lowend while using this short block. I will stroke this motor eventually.
Fordman1971 is offline  
post #14 of 78 (permalink) Old 05-05-2017, 07:02 AM Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 68
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 28 Post(s)
 
This is kind of juvenile way to approach this I guess, but I'm gonna ask anyways, as time to build, time to learn etc. are limited in reality.

What parts do I need to make a 460 make 800hp on fitech efi and still have enough vacuum for brakes, naturally aspirated and have good street driving manners. I was thinking afr 280, or 295's with afr intake if it matches without port matching it. Basically I just wanna bolt together a sweet motor, as this project is more about the truck than my motor building skills.

Carl, I got the motor but haven't been able to look at pistons yet, I'll likely, if still available go with the pistons you have on sale.
Fordman1971 is offline  
post #15 of 78 (permalink) Old 05-05-2017, 07:36 AM
Senior Member
 
4604X4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Orlando Florida
Posts: 447
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 42 Post(s)
 
800 HP in a '71 2wd pickup is not going to have good street manners.

*
1982 F-250 XLT 4x4, 5800lbs, C6-BW1345, 466 cid, 9.5:1, TFS290 PowerPort heads, Crane Hyd Roller Cam (278/286 adv., 216/224 @.050), Edelbrock Performer, Hedman headers, QFT HR-780VS, MSD6A and Billet dist., NOS Cheater system, 4.56 gearing, 7" lift, 37" tires.
4604X4 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the 460 Ford Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome