Just another 50 yr pile of Sheet! - Page 11 - 460 Ford Forum
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post #151 of 198 (permalink) Old 04-07-2014, 11:20 AM Thread Starter
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Certainly been a while since I've even looked at this rust pile, I do see how many projects go stale and then are forgotten, sold, passed on whatever.

OK, so the last time I was in the garage for any Rustang work, I took out the entire left side wheel well. This is going to be a race car for the street, so the tires will be MT Fatties, taking up the back seat area.

About half way through the left side, I mentioned that a sawzall would have been easier than my cut off wheel,.....totally forgot about that until I was about half way through again.

Small rust area / bent metal in the lower rear quarter, removed.



Probably will have to cut off a little bit more, but we'll get a closer look after the blasting. I'm wanting to save as much as possible.



Now for the big surprise, I've known that this "patch" was there since we picked it up. I could see the Bondo and picked at it until it fell out in big, thick chunks.

What I didn'y FULLY realize was the depth of the "repair".

I'm still puzzeled as to what happened here. There is an angled line where the quarter has been welded together.




Check out the thickness of the filler.





So here is where it gets interesting, this repair isn't a butted patch, but a LAP patch, hence the thick Bondo. The left half / rear of the quarter is actually UNDER the right half / front, then it was then LAP welded and filled over with Bondo.

How in the crap did this this quarter break / crack in the middle,...everything else on the quarter is straight, but there is just this lap weld all the way from the top all the way to the wheel well lip,...the entire quarter was seperated.

I'M OPEN TO ANY THOUGHTS AS TO WHAT HAPPENED HERE?!

I didn't get the inside all cut out yet, but you can feel the nice lap on the inside. I'll post up a pic when I get the rest of the well removed.

This'll be a fun repair, I don't want to replace the entire quarter, I want no problems with the vent line matching up. As stated, I do want to keep as much original metal as possible.

So has anyone done a diagonal patch panel?

Wife,........."You drove how far for that thing?"
Daughter,..."Theres no inside and it stinks."
Friend,......."Dude, thats a rusted piece of sheet."
Son,.........."This old car is cool."

USMC Security Forces, Kamiseya Japan, 0311
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post #152 of 198 (permalink) Old 04-08-2014, 06:56 AM
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Two things man, time savers.

Looks like somene did a hack repair, and just cut a piece of quarter panel to fit, lapped it with out flanging it and called it a day.

One, do not waste time on wondering what happenend and trying to fix a botch job. Just cut it back to good square lines and replace with either a quarter or patch panel. Easiest sometimes to buy a quarter and cut out what you need vice the whole quarter.

Second, I wish I had done this. Cuttoff wheels are good, but had I bit the bullet and bought a lower end Plasma cutter, I would have saved HOURS on my project. I gaurantee 60% of the time I spent on panels, tubs etc were just running a cuttoff wheel. The layout and welding was not the long pole, it was cutting out the bad stuff, and cutting the new stuff to fit. Especially the rough out, once you got it close, a cuttoff wheel is great. But for those long runs on panels, the cutt off wheel was a time sink,, and saws all just didnt get me nice lines, nor very good in tight places..

Saws All is ok for cutting really thick stuff, but the lines and kerf will be a bitch to weld back up, Plasma and cuttoff wheel do give you nice straight lines.
I also bought a flanging, punching tool for lapping panels properly. makes it easy and gives you a little buffer on alignments. Its cheap from harbor freight worked great.

Gydup -67 Coupe, 521 Kaase P51 Comp Solid Roller . Jerico DR4, narrowed & mini tubbed 9 inch with 4:56 spool , Mark Williams Axles on CALTRACS, Shaved towers.
Grabbing gears for 38 years.

Last edited by Gydyup; 04-08-2014 at 07:00 AM.
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post #153 of 198 (permalink) Old 05-19-2014, 12:30 PM Thread Starter
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Finally got some time to get at the inner wheelwell on the pass side to see what the inside of that "lapped" quarter work looks like. I could feel it by reaching around and new what had been done, but just the same was curous as to what I'd find.

From the rear looking forward,...can't really much.



This is the money shot,...front front looking backward, you can actually see the lap weld pretty clear.



So again, I'm totally puzzeled as to how and why this was done. I wouldn't thought it was possible but it appears that the quarter was somehow for some reason, cut. Look at the clean lap cut above, it had to be on purpose, the cut's waaaay clean.

Then somehow one side was pulled under the other and welded, the depression then filled with a nice slathering of Bondo,..?!


On the driver side, the inner well lip came apart pretty easily from the quarter, the pass side is still welded on solid. I'm assuming that there are spot welds,...where? How does this come apart, I've got it cut out except for a coupla inches.

Sawzall was much easier to work with than the cut off wheel.

Wife,........."You drove how far for that thing?"
Daughter,..."Theres no inside and it stinks."
Friend,......."Dude, thats a rusted piece of sheet."
Son,.........."This old car is cool."

USMC Security Forces, Kamiseya Japan, 0311
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post #154 of 198 (permalink) Old 05-19-2014, 02:56 PM
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Maybe someone was going to widen the wheel opening to fit the big slicks. Then backed out and just put it back?
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post #155 of 198 (permalink) Old 06-13-2014, 10:58 AM Thread Starter
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Finally got around to trying out my Harbor Freight spot weld cutter. I've had this thing for a while, just haven't had the desire to get into the spot weld drilling business yet.

They've gotten mixed reviews, but at $5.00 bucks a pop, there's not much to lose if it turns out to be junk.



We'll be removing the front frame rails / pan supports and running a sold connector from the front frame to a new narrowed rear frame,...not frame connectors, but a solid connection, front to rear.

There are about 10 welds on the outer support side, 10 on the bottom and another 10 on the inner side. The hardest part of drilling welds is keeping the bit from running, having my punch would have made things easier. There is a pointed center bit on the cutter, but it does still walk at times.

Like all things Mustang, the first few are the hardest, how much pressure and how far to cut into the metal are the biggest learning curves.





After 29 3/4 welds my new tool breaks on the last weld on the inner side. The tooth section breaks clean away from the bit, not from faulty import construction, but from me using to much pressure. Note to self, let the tool do the work. Fortunately I'm able to pry up the last weld and call it a day in the Mustang Garage.

So all in all, Im happy with the HF spot weld cutter. It easily went through 30 welds on one side of the double headed bit. I'll swing by HF, replace the broken one, pick up a few new ones and keep drilling. I've got the driver's side to do and then remove the support from the trans hump.

I can't imagine working without a rotisserie, this thing just makes it soooo much easier, drill, flip the car, continue drilling!

This Harbor Freight $5.00 tool gets a thumbs up from me.

Wife,........."You drove how far for that thing?"
Daughter,..."Theres no inside and it stinks."
Friend,......."Dude, thats a rusted piece of sheet."
Son,.........."This old car is cool."

USMC Security Forces, Kamiseya Japan, 0311

Last edited by Israel; 06-13-2014 at 12:28 PM.
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post #156 of 198 (permalink) Old 06-13-2014, 05:27 PM
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The lap in the quarter panel is from a portion of the quarter being replaced. Somewhere you'll run into the other edges when you strip the paint and bondo.
Rob

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post #157 of 198 (permalink) Old 06-14-2014, 09:13 AM
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LOL

Just finished reading through your buildup and I gotta say.... you got a knack for story telling!! hahaha

You definitely got your work cut out for you on that one!!! My kids both, daughter 12 and son 21, have always loved dads "projects" and just last week I picked up a 68 T-bird for the 360 horse 429 Thunder Jet and was going to part out the rest..... until my daughter went with me to get it and took a liking to it and NOW it has become a project for her first car!!! lol..... I DID NOT WANT ANOTHER PROJECT!!!!

But I told her we would do a "50 footer" job on it over this summer and she can start driving out behind the house. Then, if it turns out to be dependable, we will do a better job over the following year and a half. Yesterday she posted a pic of it on face book telling her friends to look at what she will be driving to school when she is 16!! hahaha... I'M SOOO SCREWED! Now I HAVE to finish it!! LOL

Enjoy the time spent with your son! Memories that last a lifetime and then some

Good luck on your journey!
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post #158 of 198 (permalink) Old 06-15-2014, 02:37 AM
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Quote:
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The lap in the quarter panel is from a portion of the quarter being replaced. Somewhere you'll run into the other edges when you strip the paint and bondo.
Rob
This. It's an old school repair that was actually quite common "back in the day" mainly because it was easier than replacing the full panel.There's nothing wrong with bondo either, as long as you fix the dent before you fix the dent.

80 Fairmont wagon, 528, Blue Thunder heads on E-85. Just a brutal street car
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post #159 of 198 (permalink) Old 06-15-2014, 09:38 AM
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The lap in the quarter panel is from a portion of the quarter being replaced. Somewhere you'll run into the other edges when you strip the paint and bondo.
Rob
It looks like that corner was hit at one time and they replaced the whole corner section. I have done many of those that way but we would go straight up and offset the metal edge for a flush weld. The other seams were the one in the trunk lip seal area and down the rear behind bumper (both are factory weld areas so the welds look normal/original). A lot of times the replacement panel came from a wrecked car in the junkyard because they never made a complete corner section back when I was doing them.
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post #160 of 198 (permalink) Old 06-15-2014, 02:20 PM
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It looks like that corner was hit at one time and they replaced the whole corner section. I have done many of those that way but we would go straight up and offset the metal edge for a flush weld. The other seams were the one in the trunk lip seal area and down the rear behind bumper (both are factory weld areas so the welds look normal/original). A lot of times the replacement panel came from a wrecked car in the junkyard because they never made a complete corner section back when I was doing them.
I had a paint and body man that worked for me years back that was from New York state. He said that it quite common for them in the 60's and 70's to take 3 or 4 bodys to have enough material to put together just one classic. "Rust Belt".
Rob

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post #161 of 198 (permalink) Old 06-15-2014, 03:57 PM
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I had a paint and body man that worked for me years back that was from New York state. He said that it quite common for them in the 60's and 70's to take 3 or 4 bodys to have enough material to put together just one classic. "Rust Belt".
Rob
It is still done quite often, even on newer cars. More for collusion than rust at the body shops around here. The yard will torch a good 10-12" further from where you want. Even the trunk floor and inner fender are in tack (in the case of a rear corner). Then you cut it or drill the spot welds where you want to reconnect it. My buddy down the street did a whole back half of a car! Straight across the roof, down sides and across floor. Looks like a lot of work but it actually wasn't as bad as I thought. In all my bodywork days (years) I never did a full half of a car......
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post #162 of 198 (permalink) Old 06-16-2014, 09:22 AM Thread Starter
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ag460, I like the idea of a 50 footer!

Wife,........."You drove how far for that thing?"
Daughter,..."Theres no inside and it stinks."
Friend,......."Dude, thats a rusted piece of sheet."
Son,.........."This old car is cool."

USMC Security Forces, Kamiseya Japan, 0311
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post #163 of 198 (permalink) Old 06-17-2014, 11:16 AM
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ag460, I like the idea of a 50 footer!
sure saves on being meticulous! haha Plus, she will be driving it through the back yard... which is a field, for the next couple years learning how to drive. No sense doing a good job now... Maybe when she gets closer to 15 I will do it over.

Please don't follow my way of thinking, lol..... I think you want that Stang to be better than a "fitty footer", lol
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post #164 of 198 (permalink) Old 08-01-2014, 10:29 AM
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You still alive on this project?

Gydup -67 Coupe, 521 Kaase P51 Comp Solid Roller . Jerico DR4, narrowed & mini tubbed 9 inch with 4:56 spool , Mark Williams Axles on CALTRACS, Shaved towers.
Grabbing gears for 38 years.
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post #165 of 198 (permalink) Old 08-01-2014, 11:45 AM
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Finally,....I am finally able to post some pictures of the 67 Rustang coupe!
Israel, I need to add a line to your signature. Ha

Dad,....."I knew that boy would never 'mount ta noth'n"
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