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27T Boss 572

56K views 90 replies 22 participants last post by  PickupTrucker 
#1 ·
OK guys (and gals ) , just got word today from Cliff @ JKRE that my parts are on the way. So i thought I would start a thread on the 27T Boss 572.

Parts ordered so far...
-C and C Aluminium block , 4.5" bore 10.32" deck.
-Bryant crank SBF snout , 4.5" stroke
-BME Aluminium rods
-Diamond 20cc dome top pistons ( 14+ : 1 )
-Danny Bee billet timing kit
-7/16ths JKRE pushrods
-Crower rollers
-Boss 9 Heads complete.
-Boss 9 Covers
-Boss 9 Intake

Hopefully they arrive in a week or two. During June/July we then;
-Mockup in chassis for new front and rear engine plates
-Mockup heads and covers for body clearencing
-Measurements for the new JPP fabricated sump.
-New mounts for the Peterson external oil and Waterman sprint fuel pumps.
-Heads to SpeedTorque for work and flowing.
-After headwork , order appropriate roller cam.
-Manifold machining for alcohol injectors and my 2500CFM throttle body/barrell valve
-Manifold to SpeedTorque for match porting and flow work
-Bottom end mockup for deck check etc
-Block to SpeedTorque for final hone and deck prep.

During this time we will freshen the current C6 out of the hotrod as my fallback/spare gearbox , and prep two transbraked C4's for testing also. We are going to see how much abuse the C4 can take.( I am glad I have SFI bell and sheilds for the C4 , may need them ).
I will use C6 torque convertor from locals at AllFast convertors , with adaptors for the C4. I expect something in the high 5000 to 6000RPM stall range , looking at the point where Jon has been making his power recently with Boss9 headed combos.Last resort is a powerglide.

Then in August it should be final assembly and off to the Dyno.

The car is currently 1880lbs with me in it , 545ci iron block and A429 Ali heads. With the new aluminium block , lighter rotating assembly and C4 , the diet may realise 150lb or more making the combo in the 1750lb range. If I can get the power and torque to the track , watch out as it should be a screamer.

So thats the build . Will take photos and keep all updated as I go.

John
 
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#29 ·
Thanks Rob,

it is food for thought. One of our concerns is too much down low with a 2.46 first gear . We were thinking of taking timing out in first gear if we could not control it. I am not adverse to loosing a bit of bottom end for a free-er reving top end.

John
 
#31 ·
"Does this chassis make my engine look big?" LOL
Great build brother! Can I ask who built the oil pan?

Thanks
Jason
 
#32 ·
D-Cell,

sure can , the pan was built by My racecar builder . I call Ian Jenkens from JPP a racecar builder in that he does most stuff in house. Not only chassis , but all fabrication for racecars , oil pans , tanks , trans building , electrical , electronics etc etc.

It will be interesting when we get it on the dyno , to have a look at what the oil is doing. This has got three flat trays with a scraper lip on each , and also has two chambers and two gates. I was losing oil pressure on the last engine just after hitting max negative gees when the chutes blossomed in the braking area. The data logger showed it quite clearly that it dropped from 100psi through the traps , rolled off it and we had an rpm related drop to 70-80psi , then chutes and a drop to 30psi. All the oil was in the covers and the valley , with little left in the sump for good pickup. The two gates gates are to try and keep more oil in the rear of the sump around the pickup during shutdown.

The Boss 9 also looks like its going to have drain back problems ( specially when compared to my old A429 ) , so I am going to carry up to 3 gallons ( 12 litres ) initially on the dyno to see how much oil gets pumped into the valley and covers and how bad ( or good ) the drain back is. I use a 30W60 racing oil as I believe big engines need big oil.

The two peice design is so I dont have an excuse not to regularly check the Aluminium rods and bearings. With an O Ring seal and easy to get to fastners , it can be done in a half hour.

Not a cheap oil pan though!!!

John
 
#33 ·
Quick Update Guys

Just a quick update for those that might be wondering.

Attached is a couple of photo's. Jenks at JPP has finished the remodelling of all my alternator , oil pump and fuel pump on the front of the motor to suit the Danny Bee and new engine plate. It is all a little more compact now , as the little altered chassis is filling up quick.

Now its just leads and exhausts and off it goes to the Dyno. Anyone know a good set of around the rocker covers leads for this thing. Race Chrysler Hemi leads are too large diameter in the plug tubes, maybe Ford Modular will fit?

Had to order the 2 3/8th 304 stainless u-Bends for the zoomies from Specialty Design Products over there in the US. No one carries that size here , let alone bends it of a 6" radius. They should look cool , as long as they sound good at 7500rpm plus , they should do the trick.

Post again soon,

John
 

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#35 ·
If by "Stick" you mean the bump stick , then it is an aggressive custom Comp , 282/288 @ 50" , 770/740 lift. We have others of various sizes , but considering how good the .300-.600 flow numbers are , its a reasonably safe place to start. The dyno should tell us what the motor wants , and we will get another grind after our first session. Its hard having not played naturally aspirated alcohol hemi's before to figure out what these heads will do/will want. All other hemi's we have played with have all been blown alcohol.

The heads will only take a .800 lift with 20-30th lash ( 770-780 at the valve ) and we did not want to go to the expense of installing longer valves and/or cutting the spring pockets deeper and having to play with the geometry to go higher lift.

John
 
#36 ·
Zoomie's Now Mocked Up

The zoomies are taking shape. Also included a more detailed photo of the front package showing alternator, oil pump, fuel pump , crank trigger , injection shutoff and bypasses etc.
 

Attachments

#38 ·
Rob,

it sure is tight for room at the front , but turning the alternator around and running it from a pully mounted behind the balancer picked us up a bunch of room.

As for the zoomies , we are going to dyno the engine with a set of borrowed 2 1/4 headers and then swap onto the zoomies for a quick pull to do a back to back comparison ( if the dyno operator doesnt mind the noise ) Could be interesting.

John
 
#39 ·
Ouch, my ears! lol You ought to record the sound pressure levels! lol I'll bet you'll lose a few horses across the board over the long tubes. Keep the dyno #'s coming, this ought to be interesting. (I hope the dyno room has wire in the glass!) ;)
Rob
 
#48 ·
Dyno Day Monday

Well , the fire ups went well in the shed , no embarissing mishaps so engine is out again and off to the Dyno on Monday. 120 litres of methanol , and 3 spare oil changes , for a heavy day or two to see if we can get any power out of this thing.
Looking at the results on here for the Boss 9 combo's , I hope I am pleasantly surprised , but cant see it making 1000hp. The dyno I am going to had a freind/competetors Chev 555 Smidt engine on it that came from the US with a 1050hp sheet , yet only made 924 on the Superflow Dyno. It went 7.24 @ 189mph in a 1800lb altered last weekend.I was hopeing to go faster than him in mine.
Similar dyno results with so called 900hp sprint car engines that only go 820hp, so it may just be a conservative dyno.
What will be it will be I suppose.
Will post the good or bad next week.

John.
 
#51 · (Edited)
Dyno Flop

Well that was a waste of a day! Not really , just fealling a bit down.

Set up was 28 degrees , cam straight up at 112 , fat as on the injection ( 85 pill with 600 gears in the Waterman).

We used more water than fuel. The sleeves might still be a proud in the block and we have sprung water leaks to the oil . Hope thats it , because finding a casting fault will be much harder. Kept milking the oil every start up with only gentle pull to 5500, and after two pulls and pulling fuel out of it going to 105 pill , it was starting to get obvious. It was missing like a bi#ch and fouling plugs. We think the fouling might be from oil getting sucked into the intake ports through the rocker cover bolt holes that penetrate the ports. Changed ignitions , changed wires , changed plugs , changed oil ( 4 times at 10 litres a go ). With 28 degrees in it and the cam straight up , Geoff the dyno guy shut her down at 6000rpm , the highest rpm we got. 700hp and 720 ftlb at 5000 , 800hp and 710ft/lb at 6000. So torque was way down. Call it a day , strip it down and find our problems.

Bright side :) , nothing in the filter , didnt throw a rod , valve train clearences OK , so that should = no damage.

It lives to fight another day!!!

John
 
#52 ·
Well, we glued the engine back up , this time sealing the head gaskets to the block. Did a bench mount warm up prior to going off to the dyno , and guess what. Water in the oil again. Starting to get me stumped for answers.

Pulled the manifold , no leaks there. Left the heads on , built plates for the head water jackets with a water filler and air line fitting. Glued them on , filled the block and heads with water , put 10PSI into it and got a fan spray of water out of the valley.

The block is cracked just above one of the lifter bores. Poked it with a screw driver and it fell into the water jacket. Same on the next lifter bore and all the way down that side.

Clearencing the block for the ZBar lifters has left the wall in those locations paper thin. We milled about 150thou in that location to give the ZBar tie boss about 20 thou of clearence as the lifters would initially not fit in the block. Now its too thin. The other side is OK though , so it may be core shift in the casting. Brand new aluminium block and we are already welding patches into it.

This engine building has knobs on it . Again , appreciate what your builder sometimes has to go through , its a lot different to engine assembly!!
 
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