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Experimental aluminum CJ heads

10K views 43 replies 12 participants last post by  161854 
#1 ·
I have seen it mentioned several times that there were experimental aluminum CJ heads cast in the early 70s. Dyno Dons name keeps coming up when the heads are talked about.

Does anyone have any information on these heads and the intakes that may have been used with them? I think they may have been developed for use in the early days of Pro Stock.


Thanks to all replies................ron
 
#2 ·
I know he had used them in 1977, along with a expirimental aluminum block.
He had it in his Mustang II Pro Stocker for match racing and it was a 500 cubic incher. First doorslammer in the 7's.
Dont know what happened to all his stuff after he passed.
I had purchased some of his old pro stock Cleveland stuff, and it was amazing the kind of mods that were done.
 
#4 ·
1977? They were a little late in developing them. Must not have been very many made. Probably a pretty good weight break for running a wedge head too. Early 80s all I remember was boss head stuff.
 
#3 ·
"SK" heads and intake

I have seen a pair of the alum SCJ heads in person, but the intake I have not. The picture I have seen of the intake showed it to have a 4500 Dominator carb flange. The intake bared a strong resemblance to the Victor! Both the heads and the intake carried Fomoco "SK" part numbers. The heads that I saw were pretty much modified to the max. They had 'high port' plates installed. A truck puller had been using them with great results other than they tended to leak water..................
 
#5 ·
I have seen a pair of the alum SCJ heads in person, but the intake I have not. The picture I have seen of the intake showed it to have a 4500 Dominator carb flange. The intake bared a strong resemblance to the Victor! Both the heads and the intake carried Fomoco "SK" part numbers. The heads that I saw were pretty much modified to the max. They had 'high port' plates installed. A truck puller had been using them with great results other than they tended to leak water..................
Ah the "SK" pn. I guess they all would be about used up, cut up , or modified max effort without regard to longevity. That what race heads are for right. thanks
 
#7 · (Edited)
The SK heads were cast in '69. They had nothing to do with Pro Stock when they were made. They were for Can Am use. The intake ports were smaller than CJs. Another unique frature was the combustion chamber was cast iron! the cast iron piece was inserted into the mold patterns and then the aluminum was poured around it. This actually worked well until Dyno dropped a valve and cracked the chamber. The head was repaired out here by Bob Mullen and the entire chamber was welded up leaving three still with the original cast iron chambers. Don made them into high ports and they did crack at the base of the machined area. The (near 500ci) engine gave Don an Jon( Kaase) fits *** they could get it to run a good ET wth poor mph or big MPH with a poor ET. They were "shelved" and the engine(s) were swithched to Boss heads The single plane "spider" intakes were developed for the Nascar program when the 429wedge was considered for the downsizing to 366ci that was considered by Nascar. Dyno was a great guy.RIP
I bought the all aluminum cleveland he used to break into the 7's ( first match race pro stocker to do it) , and Don used the money to buy 4 Can Am aluminum blocks from a boat racer in NC. I still have that SK numbered engine.
 
#9 ·
Sorry Dave,
That's the main reason I bouight it in '78. the 351 was 429ci and that may be where the confusion came from. Fresh off the match race circut. The 429s were run later in the year as the blocks were bought after I go it.
 
#11 · (Edited)
There is SOOOO much stuff that was done "back in the day". For instance compare the "modern" shaft rocker systems to the "antique" Boss 429 that was designed/developed as a Prototype engine in '68.
 
#16 ·
Randy,
I've been lucky enough to own ( and owned) a large amount of experimental stuff and have one of the largest collections of paper work and still own a fair amount of experimental parts. I've spent 50 years chasing this stuff.
 
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#18 ·
That stuff is really interesting if even just to see and to imagine what the factory guys might have been thinking. It seems too like Ford made so much experimental hardware for the 351C and Boss 429 engines that never really saw the light of day in any sort of numbers. I would like to see some more pictures of the X pushrod 351C and the aluminum CJ heads with a cast iron chamber, cool stuff for sure.


I remember a racing team that my dad worked for having at least two or three Boss 429 engines sitting in storage with the two piece oil pan/factory dry sump stuff. Valve covers were probably magnesium too.
 
#19 ·
Dave ,
For years , before I modified the heads , I tried to find an intake that Ford had to have made. I have heard there is a display engine in an east coast museum but it doesn;t have an intake either. My SK books show an SK number for a dual four intake , so I know one was at least "drawn up". Most former "triple E" engineers have never heard of the engine despite working there in the day! It is my understanding that 6-10 heads were cast and machined. I know of 6 for sure. The fact that the late Smokey Yunick had an NOS pair drew some speculation but I have nothing concrete that he had anything to do with their design.
 
#22 ·
Kaase slightly redesigned the iron Cobra Jet head for Ford Motorsport which became the A429 head.
Ed Lyons kinda pushed them through for Ford Motorsport getting them in the system. I am sure Kaase got some ideas from his days with Dyno Don.
Then, a few years later, he completely changed the A429 heads to become the SCJ aluminum heads.

Like almost everybody Ford deals with, after they eventually screwed Kaase, he came out with his P-51 heads which were an improved and ported version of those SCJ's.
 
#23 ·
I also seen a set of cast iron expirimental 429 CJ heads that were 3 valve.
They were cast, and partially machined. The factory never finished machined them. They looked just like a standard CJ head externally except the spark plug placement was slightly different as I recall.
Wish I had pics of them, they were quite interesting. They were for sale quite a few years ago at the now defunct "Ford Power Parts" in So. Cal.
 
#24 ·
Those were off shoots of the "Caliope" engine that was 429 based , not FE based as often reported. There was far more than spark plug placement different on that pair of heads. One running engine was built that I know of and it didn't make it off of the dyno at Ford. Yes there were MANY things that never saw the light of day, and not all were viable. That's why they called it Experimental, LOL
 
#25 ·
Dave ,
The picture you posted looks to be after I sold the engine , possibly at Dyno Don's when he freshened it. Do you know the source of the picture? As I said I have lost track of where the engine went so I can't be of help with more pictures of it. Any idea of where it is now?
 
#26 ·
I can't remember where I found that picture anymore. My understanding of the X pushrod engine was that it needed a special cam core with the lifters in a different order to work is that correct? To me it seems like a better experimental configuration to have tried would have been to cast the head with the order of the valves reversed to make the intake ports more uniform in a single four barrel configuration. I wonder if that was ever tried? Probably.. I was thinking about the X pushrod head and I wonder if it might have been a Smokey Yunick Boss 302 influenced idea. Didn't they run the Boss 302 with two carburetors back in the Trans Am days? If so maybe making the port itself straighter was a very good approach. It was certainly worth trying. I wonder what the valve pierce points are like on the X pushrod heads? Does the rocker geometry work better with the Boss 302 deck height or the 351C?
 
#28 ·
The criss cross head was Cleveland based only. The ports were larger and more rectangular than the production Cleveland. The cam was a round lobe billet designed at Crower. It was a real challenge to grind as the normal exhaust lobe ran the intake valve and the normal intake lobe ran the exhaust. This is why it had to be a round lobe core to start with. Getting the timing events right was a real challenge and the cam was not perfect as received. I think Dyno had it reground by Crower after I sold it and the lobe seperation issues were fixed then. Smokey had an unused set that were sold at his auction. The other set is on the complete engine in the Carolinas. The valve locations were standard 351C , nothing changed. The pushrod geometry is a bit better than a regular 351C. The rockers are way askew looking but are smooth acting.
Yes the '69 rules said dual fours could be run in T/A and Ford elected to go with twin dominators. The difference was they were IR like Weber carbs and were fine size wise. If the manifold had a plenum , the carbs would have drowned the little 302. The T/A heads had smaller ports cast in them than the production Boss 302/351C heads. For 1970 a really small intake port ( like a filled port) head was made they are pretty rare nowdays.
 
#30 · (Edited)
Carl,
Twenty + years ago Alan Root ( as Randy mentioned) made a deal with Holman Moody where HUNDREDS of casting core patterns were stored. It seems that Ford dispositioned( read dumped) them to H&M in case they wanted to produce any of the stuff after they felt it was obsolete. I personally saw all ofit when I visited H&M in 1977 and was amazed at the patterns I saw for stuff that "didn't exist". Three two barrels for a Boss 429, regular 429 ( and CJ) as well as a Boss 302 tripower. Block patterns 427 SOHC patterns 255 indy patterns , etc. It was un beliveable and the giant wood shipping crates were stacked three high!
Anyway Alan made the deal and it was supposedly three semi loads. Something in the deal changed and when the stuff showed here in Ca, the dollar figures changed ( according to lore) when the trucks showed and two loads were lost to non payment. Again this is local lore and not verified by Alan nor is it meant to harm his integrity.
Once the patterns were in his posession Alan enlisted Jon Kaase who had also helped him on the A/R B9 head sold to Ford . The head "may" have had some Ford funding but Alan produced the head before it was in the Ford Motorsport catalogs sporting the Cobra Jet logo. It would not surprise me that some of the core patterns were useable and used to produce the first heads. FYI The Ford "J" 302 heads were also done by A/R and sold through Ford.
 
#32 ·
Digging out the old SVO catalog piqued my interest so I went trawling through my old Super Ford magazines and found an article in the March '92 edition. The article was all about the new Alan Root/Ford Motorsports aluminum Cobra Jet cylinder head P/N M-6049-A429. So given the magazine lead time, these heads would have been around from at least late 1991, early 1992.
 
#34 · (Edited)
Read over on Kasse's website and he states that when Dyno went 7.99 at Englishtown, it was done with the a 516 'Can Am' block using the "SK" heads.....
I remember when that happened. I have a National Dragster with the article in it too. All I can tell you is the money I paid for the all aluminum cleveland (which had run in the 7's already) went toward the purchase of the 494 blocks. The run at E Town obviously drew more attention and may be the first time NHRA recognized a sub 8 second run. I originally wanted to buy his 392" XE Windsor style engine but it was too severely damaged. The block was almost cracked in half as those blocks were not up to the horsepower Don and Jon were making. I found the boat racer that had 4 Can Am blocks for Dyno and gave him the phone number to make the deal. I bought the engine in '78 and still own it. I sent cash in two seperate Ford Boss 302 connecting rod boxes to Don's house in Atlanta where the engine was. Jon had to sleeve the #1 cam bearing bore before he could re assemble it and ship it to me in Ca. You won't find that information on Jon's website. I began helping Don in the late '60's and became Earl Wade's "go fer". I spent time with them when they were in town but never went on the road. Jon came on the scene in '76 as full time crew cheif and was the main reason Don won the Pro Stock championship. My information is as I lived it , not from "legend or lore". I miss Dyno and Earl every day. Jon and I are still good friends.
 
#35 ·
Fascinating read !!!

Thank you to all who have contributed !!! :D




S
 
#40 ·
Dave, he said that it was a 427CI Cleveland back then and I know that some old match race stuff did not get recorded into the record books because it was not a NHRA, IHRA or AHRA event, I know this because my Dad was a record chaser back in the 70's too, at one time he had the record for G/S and it was a 400- 4 speed GTO way back in the AHRA days.
 
#41 · (Edited)


Look what I found! I thought I have seen this before.
Credit goes to Pat Ganahl in his book : Ford Performance on page 119

Sorry for it being sideways, I flipped it in photobucket .
 
#44 ·
Pat couldn't have photographed the cleveland as I already owned it. That engine was built after I got it. There is an article on the aluminum 392 and the cleveland when Dyno still owned it. I'll see if I can find it.The motor is not for sale and won't be as long as I am alive. If I do anything it will be re uniting the engine with the world championship Mustang II currently at Dick Estevez's shop in Maryland.
 
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