460 Ford Forum banner

1 - 20 of 50 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,297 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Last year's EMC sure had a lot of FE motors :shock: 8) to keep the faith, but NOT one 385 based BBF :cry:

Even some of our Ford faithful went brand X :shock:

So, with the top three engines being 400+ inches safe to say the cubic inch penalty is not as bad as some thought.

So anyone going 385 this year ? (and before you wiseguys ask why I don't... well I'd love to but don't have $$$ to put into such a venture :( )

Steve
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
928 Posts
68xr7cat said:
So anyone going 385 this year ? (and before you wiseguys ask why I don't... well I'd love to but don't have $$$ to put into such a venture :( )

Steve
Man I would love to make a try at EMC myself but I am in the same boat you are and that is I can't afford it. but going to be interested to see what does transpire.

Oh well maybe if i hit the lottery LOL
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
133 Posts
Do they have the new rules out for the 2008 EMC ? I guess I missed them if so. Yeah, I really liked seeing the FE's in there, I've got some HIPO, FE parts still sitting around here. But, with building big cubes easy & cheap the 385 is the way to go.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,483 Posts
Hmmmmm,

-Stock bore and stroke
-Stock valve angles (no Kaase SCJ or P-51's? They said CJ and SCJ are okay, but didn't clarify if that means OEM or Kaase's heads)
-Stock port openings (TFS Streets seem to be in a grey area)
-No welding in the chamber or alteration of the port openings
-Flat tappet cams

Sounds like fun....

Special offer: :mrgreen: I'll design and build an engine for the competition, customer will retain the engine after competition is complete. Engine to be supplied to the customer at my cost. All entry fees, developmental and travel expenses to be absorbed by the builder (me).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,956 Posts
Well the rules say that the SCJ heads are allowed. That has to be, the Kaase designed FRPP SCJ head. They have been used in the past by numerous EMC contestants, so I see no reason why they won't be allowed again. Furthermore, I would suspect, that the P-51 heads are legal also, since they have the same valve pierce points and take the same piston. Those two heads are like brothers to each other. One would need to seek approval from EMC, just to be sure.

I see no problem with the TFS Street heads being legal. I don't see a grey area, because a stock exhaust manifold will bolt right up to it, without any bolt hole slotting or spacers or header adapters.

Carl, do you have a dyno?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
928 Posts
well it seems they have a conflict in the rules to me. As charlie pointed out they say motorsport CJ and SCJ heads allowed, now I am sure they are talking about the A429 heads being ok obviously but by the rules right above that the SCJ alum head and the P51 are specifically disallowed

Aftermarket cylinder heads that
maintain compatibility with OEM passenger car intake and exhaust manifolds are not allowed if
the aftermarket manufacturer has altered the valve angles from the original OEM design. Valves
must retain OEM valve angles (+ or -1 degree). Cylinder head decks may be milled as long as
the milling does not affect the valve angle more than the 1-degree variance allowed by the rules.
That doesn't leave any wiggle room, it's specifically states must retain OEM valve angles + or - 1 degree which the SCJ and P51s do NOT do. And it does state that the OEM angles can NOT be changed by the aftermarket manufacturere so it's not just a can't be changed by the contestant.

I would want VERY specific clarification from them on that before even bothering to start to attempt it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,854 Posts
To the powers at Popular Hot Rodding, the AMC is a Chrysler Corporation engine since they merged.
The rules don't mention anything about AMC engines; they are Mopar engines now.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,483 Posts
c.evans said:
Well the rules say that the SCJ heads are allowed. That has to be, the Kaase designed FRPP SCJ head. They have been used in the past by numerous EMC contestants, so I see no reason why they won't be allowed again. Furthermore, I would suspect, that the P-51 heads are legal also, since they have the same valve pierce points and take the same piston. Those two heads are like brothers to each other. One would need to seek approval from EMC, just to be sure.

I see no problem with the TFS Street heads being legal. I don't see a grey area, because a stock exhaust manifold will bolt right up to it, without any bolt hole slotting or spacers or header adapters.

Carl, do you have a dyno?
No dyno on sight Charlie, but I do have an arrangement with somebody here in town, so extensive testing wouldn't be a problem.

The only reason I suspect the TFS's to be in question is the raised exhaust port. It's not in the factory location, but you're right, the rules define factory location by the ability of factory manifolds to bolt up. Seems like it should be legal, but I could see somebody protesting and sighting the intent of the rule. The rules also say no external modification of the ports, and the port is sort of externally modified, but from it's manufacturer. Probably best to get approval upon entry.

Maybe Jon can tell us the reasoning behind the Boss 429? The rules don't seem like they would allow his new Boss heads due to the valve angle deal. Has he already talked to them about the P-51's and been denied? Have some old Boss heads gathering dust? Boss headed engine more sale-able after the contest? Looking for a new challenge? Just for fun?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,854 Posts
It is my understanding that the port locations AND valve angles on Jon's "new" Boss 429 head are exactly as the production parts were; other things were changed to make the head much more user friendly and able to use a Wedge 385 block.

About the TFS and other brand heads of that raised port design; the rules spell out that a RAISED RUNNER is allowed as long as the production bolt pattern and manifold will directly bolt-on with NO spacers of any kind - intake OR exhaust.

NO external modifications are allowed to the heads from the way they are delivered by their manufacturer; (not original OEM manufacturer).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,048 Posts
Randy Jon raised the bottom of the exhaust port to get the water clearance he needed to make the base of the head thicker. I don't know if that matters for EMC or not.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,483 Posts
rmcomprandy said:
It is my understanding that the port locations AND valve angles on Jon's "new" Boss 429 head are exactly as the production parts were;
Hmmmm,

Boss 429:


Kaase Boss:
http://460ford.com/viewtopic.php?t=20415

I guess if he's running the new head, that answers the "why".
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,483 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,048 Posts
I remember that story Would have not guessed thats where the pic came from. Good story.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,286 Posts
Since the SCJ heads are being made by Ford Racing (at least sold by them) doesn't that mean they're OEM? If the original equipment manufacturer is Ford and Ford Racing sells the SCJ heads, I'd think that'd be the same. I'm probably way off in my thinking, but it makes sense to my likely uninformed brain.
 
1 - 20 of 50 Posts
Top