460 Ford Forum banner

1 - 18 of 18 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hey There everyone. New user...well sort of, lost my old password and email (4speed390) and now I had to make a new one. So I'm back after a long hiatus. Anyway got a few questions as I am quite excited to get back in to the 385 series world. First ones are these:

I am looking at buying a 88-97 F250 w/ a 460 very soon, and I wanted to know the common gripes with them, or any average mileage before needing a rebuild, and anything I should be looking for when I go to purchase?

Along with that, I wanted to see if anyone was making a good EFI intake for them, and what kind of other performance mods I could do whilst still getting it through emissions, which isn't that strict in PA for trucks that old.

Finally any additional information you can provide (or if you know of one that is available, it seems they are pretty hard to come by around here in Philly.) I have found one, but am waiting for more information on it.

Any help is appreciated.

Thanks,
Jim
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
8,721 Posts
With proper bowl work and intake runner exit work the EFI 460 platform can make excellent TQ and HP. 525 / 400 and still work with the OEM SD or Cali MAF EFI...


See this link to our 50 states emissions compliant and SD compatible crate engine combination. Feel free to use as a guide.


https://www.facebook.com/pg/PpamLLC/photos/?tab=album&album_id=449921202052229

Cam specs are custom and designed for emissions compliance, SD compatibility and good towing performance.

Video of typical crate combo on dyno using carb adapter.



https://www.facebook.com/PpamLLC/videos/2277984679108957/





SJ
used 2b RHP

:D
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16 Posts
Find a California version, it will already be Mass Air Flow rather than Speed Density. That will save some headaches and fabrication costs.

Sent from my SM-N950W using Tapatalk
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
8,721 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
So, if I cannot find a CA version with MAF...I forget how SD will be more difficult to tune. Were there any other years that came with MAF? I am only looking for small upgrades as of now. Are the F3TE heads the only ones I can use for fuel injection?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16 Posts
So, if I cannot find a CA version with MAF...I forget how SD will be more difficult to tune. Were there any other years that came with MAF? I am only looking for small upgrades as of now. Are the F3TE heads the only ones I can use for fuel injection?
To keep the existing IV computer you will need a Moates Quaterhorse and either learn how to change the tables or pay someone to do it for you.

Keep in mind that SD is not adaptive to changes, it is just an approximation based on a pressure sensor and default calculations from set lookup tables. One of the reasons why large elevation changes are problematic for SD.

I partially mitigate elevation changes in mine by having two different fuel types.

Sent from my SM-N950W using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16 Posts
Yes, for a few grand.

The mad porter probably has a more cost effective option with a crate engine.

Converting difficulties depends on how the engine is balanced and if it already has options or the mounts for a trigger.

Sent from my SM-N950W using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
141 Posts
So, if I cannot find a CA version with MAF...I forget how SD will be more difficult to tune. Were there any other years that came with MAF? I am only looking for small upgrades as of now. Are the F3TE heads the only ones I can use for fuel injection?
I need to add a tuner to my 95 460/528 stroker for my motorhome.
I looked at Moates Quarterhorse and the TwEECer.
With the Quarterhorse you get the tuner from one source, the software from another source and then pay another person to write the tune.
With the TwEECer you purchase the tuner and then down load the free software from from the same source. I elected to pay Mike Glover, the designer of the tuner and software, to write the tune.
What better than the designer to write the tune. Mike was great to work with and his fee was $250.00.
When returning from snow birding, I stopped in the Huston, TX area and called Mike and took him and his bride out to lunch. It was great talking tuning with Mike.

Richard
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
That sounds like a good plan...one question, which software is Mikes? TwEECer or Quarterhorse?
I need to add a tuner to my 95 460/528 stroker for my motorhome.
I looked at Moates Quarterhorse and the TwEECer.
With the Quarterhorse you get the tuner from one source, the software from another source and then pay another person to write the tune.
With the TwEECer you purchase the tuner and then down load the free software from from the same source. I elected to pay Mike Glover, the designer of the tuner and software, to write the tune.
What better than the designer to write the tune. Mike was great to work with and his fee was $250.00.
When returning from snow birding, I stopped in the Huston, TX area and called Mike and took him and his bride out to lunch. It was great talking tuning with Mike.

Richard
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
8,721 Posts
Maybe I need to clarify.

The engine combination I outlined above at 466 to 472" works with OEM SD ECU programming. An adjustable FPR to mitigate the lean condition at WOT and heavy acceleration out of closed loop is helpful along with 26# injectors if you are at or near sea level. Some additional initial timing gets the total timing closer to ideal. The fuel trim window will take care of closed loop operation.

Is there room for improvement? Yes.
Is it absolutely necessary? No.

The OEM 33 gph fuel pump(s) and 24# injectors are at their limit at 365 ish hp which is about what the build makes as installed.
Quantum fuel systems makes drop in 255 lph fuel pump modules.


In certain heavyweight Class A and C MH applications the OEM 460 does not make enough throttled torque to move the vehicle in closed loop so WOT or near WOT operation is in the high 13's to low 14's AF which over time hurts exhaust valves and seats. Not to mention cooking the exhaust manifolds lol.

If you improve throttled torque the ecm will stay in closed loop longer with an increase in fuel economy. We have some clients reporting between 12 and 13.7 mpg in F250 4x and F350 applications.

If you want to push beyond the power the linked combination provides then a custom tune is going to be necessary.

We have several 545" EFI combinations that make near 500 hp and over 625 tq in a very similar operational window as the OEM engine does.
Custom tune definitely required.

With a bit of runner work at the exits the OEM intake is pretty good. Long runners and smallish cross section make for good torque both part throttle and at WOT.

Hope this helps clarify.


SJ
used 2b RHP


:D
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1 Posts
Hi! I am new to the forum!
I have a 1996 F250 with the 7.5L 460 and it doesn't have a timing pointer on the timing cover. Does anyone know the Ford pn or where I can find one for the timing cover for the electric fuel pump? I am lost as to how to set the timing and it pings now.
Thanks much!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16 Posts
Hi! I am new to the forum!

I have a 1996 F250 with the 7.5L 460 and it doesn't have a timing pointer on the timing cover. Does anyone know the Ford pn or where I can find one for the timing cover for the electric fuel pump? I am lost as to how to set the timing and it pings now.

Thanks much!
You should make your own thread.

Timing marks are usually on the balancer and on the chain sprockets, not on the cover. ... Not really sure if any of the 7.5L have them on the cover.

A quick image search gives me the attached one. My truck is about 40min away, so it's not my image.


Sent from my SM-N950W using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13 Posts
… Along with that, I wanted to see if anyone was making a good EFI intake for them, and what kind of other performance mods I could do whilst still getting it through emissions, which isn't that strict in PA for trucks that old.
Jim, the idea is that EFI is EFI, and there are different control methods, and people to tune them — optionally you. If sourcing a factory setup, it can be either SD or MAF, but you'll need to have both the control (a.k.a. ECM/ECU/PCM, etc) for the type of system and the programming ability for that controller. That second part may be limiting if you are not the tuner, and often rests with your tuner's choice of type and programs they are most comfortable with.

Aftermarket ECMs are fully user-tunable without extra paid (or minimal cost) programming, but "factory-hacking" programs are necessary with factory-based systems of course. Each system needs what it needs, as they all do roughly the same things in similar ways, but in different styles and 'languages'. So, MAF and SD are both good systems, each with their own pros and cons so one is not 'better' than the other in a general sense, but require either choice by control and tuning method required, or choose the control and tuning required for the system method. Either can be tuned to provide required emissions. I hope that makes sense how I said it and helps you plan your choices. :rolleyes:


David
 
1 - 18 of 18 Posts
Top