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I am building/rebuilding the 460 in my 85 F250 4x4 4spd (with gear vendors overdrive) as a street-daily-towing vehicle seeing most of its life at lower RPM and part throttle highway running under load. I have done a lot of searching and reading of old posts here and elsewhere but most of the builds I find are high RPM high horse racing car applications. I am looking for advice, experience and input from people who have done such High torque low rpm towing builds before. I intend to over build for longevity and durability. I am looking to keep pace with the Diesels (and hopefully get some sort of fuel economy out of it). Please don't tell me I would be better off swapping to a diesel, if that was the goal for this project I wouldn't be asking on a 460 forum.

Here are my intentions so far though they are clearly open to suggestion.

545 Stroker 4.5" stroke, 4.39" bore, 6.7" rod
Fully balanced
Forged crank
full floating wrist pins
Fluidampr or TCI rattler harmonic balancer
Gapless piston rings
Pistons are subject to compression ratio and valve clearance concerns based on cam profile.
I was always under the impression that forged pistons were not for street use, but that seems to be the common suggestion, has this philosophy changed?

Pump gas friendly compression ratio. ( I will likely always run premium but the varying and poor quality of todays gasoline as well as detonation are concerns)

Trick Flow Power Port 290 aluminum cylinder heads, ARP studs
Edelbrock heads were considered but the trick flows seem better on the exhaust side and combustion chamber design. I am not married to this head selection, but most of the other popular aluminum heads (cobra Jet, P-51, AFR) are geared toward high rpm use. I do not want to port and rebuild factory cast cylinder heads and end up with new aluminum head money tied up in old cast heads.

Edelbrock Pro-Flo 4 fuel injection
Is this single plane manifold setup going to be a problem for port velocity at lower rpms? Edelbrock Performer (not RPM) intake was heavily suggested for the lower rpm high torque build for higher port velocity and that dual plane design differs greatly from the single plane manifold Edelbrock uses for their Injection setup. Also I am uncertain of the Performer intakes ability to adequately feed this displacement. The techs at Edelbrock said the positioning of the injectors in their system eliminated the need for the dual plane design but I am skeptical of that answer.

MSD 6AL spark box (if compatible with Edelbrock ProFlo 4 distributor)
Timing?
Spark plugs?
High Volume oil pump

Hydraulic roller camshaft
In reading older posts on such builds Comp Cams #34-232-4 XM262H (262/[email protected]" - 218/[email protected]" - .514"/.524" lift - 112 separation) was suggested, however that was a smaller displacement build, that is not a roller cam, and that post was about 10 years ago so I am not sure where to go with cam selection from there. I do not have to pass smog so an aggressive cam without pollution equipment considerations is acceptable, however I do want some vacuum, low rpm throttle response, idle quality, cold weather manners and the truck is equipped with A/C. Daily driving is possible so I don't want it to be a pain to drive.

full roller rockers (what rocker arm ratio should I be using here?)

Stainless ceramic coated exhaust headers.
What primary diameter should I run?
Long tube, shorty, tri Y, or something different for this application?
20+ years ago Flowmaster used to offer some slip on 4-2-1 collectors that I had used with much success but I can no longer find them available anywhere and they only work on long tube headers.

True Dual exhaust (3"?) with X pipe and high flow mufflers

What temp thermostat?
Also, I know in the Diesel world eliminating the engine driven fan and going all electric is not done because the electric fans cannot produce enough airflow to keep up with the cooling needs of the diesels. Is that also the case with a big gas engine in this type of application or can I successfully run electric fans only and eliminate the engine driven fan?

Thank you in advance, I look forward to every ones experience and input.
 

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Location / operational altitude?

Weight you will be hauling?

We do a low RPM towing build at 521 inches with AFR 280 heads that makes serious torque 650+ and hp 550+ with peaks in the proper range for a work engine.

Feel free to use as a guide.


Static c/r can be adjusted for operational altitude as needed.


SJ
used 2b RHP


.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Location / operational altitude?

Weight you will be hauling?

We do a low RPM towing build at 521 inches with AFR 280 heads that makes serious torque 650+ and hp 550+ with peaks in the proper range for a work engine.

Feel free to use as a guide.


Static c/r can be adjusted for operational altitude as needed.


SJ
used 2b RHP


.
Missouri / 771ft +/-
Weight will vary but 24,000 plated truck will run at gross but will also have a almost equal amount of unloaded miles.

The engine you describe sounds very much like what I am looking to build.

Is the engine you linked to a roller cam? Are those forged or cast pistons? Have you ever built a fuel injected version?
 

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Missouri / 771ft +/-
Weight will vary but 24,000 plated truck will run at gross but will also have a almost equal amount of unloaded miles.

The engine you describe sounds very much like what I am looking to build.

Is the engine you linked to a roller cam? Are those forged or cast pistons? Have you ever built a fuel injected version?
Given the loaded GVW I'd opt for a bit less static c/r.

Pistons are forged autotec from our proprietary line of AFR pistons.

Cam is a mild HFT.

This particular combo is well suited to a self learning EFI system like the Holley Sniper.
Port EFI would require a Torker-2 intake and move the peaks up a bit.


SJ
used 2b RHP
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Given the loaded GVW I'd opt for a bit less static c/r.

Pistons are forged autotec from our proprietary line of AFR pistons.

Cam is a mild HFT.

This particular combo is well suited to a self learning EFI system like the Holley Sniper.
Port EFI would require a Torker-2 intake and move the peaks up a bit.


SJ
used 2b RHP
So, if I retained the 545 displacement as opposed to 521 Would the increased airflow requirements change the impact the torker-2 manifold would have over the rpm?
I thought I had seen someplace that was building Pro-Flow4 systems on different manifolds but cannot seem to find that now.

I had read some articles on the AFR heads that said their port arrangement required the use of their matching intake manifold. Is this no longer the case?

Are forged pistons no longer frowned upon for use in street vehicles?

At 545ci would this still be enough cam? and how would this cam translate to a hydraulic roller rather than flat?
 

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So, if I retained the 545 displacement as opposed to 521 Would the increased airflow requirements change the impact the torker-2 manifold would have over the rpm?
I thought I had seen someplace that was building Pro-Flow4 systems on different manifolds but cannot seem to find that now.

I had read some articles on the AFR heads that said their port arrangement required the use of their matching intake manifold. Is this no longer the case?

Are forged pistons no longer frowned upon for use in street vehicles?

At 545ci would this still be enough cam? and how would this cam translate to a hydraulic roller rather than flat?

I replied to your PM on our FB page.

High silicon forgings with tight piston to wall clearances are great for the street.

AFR heads work fine with the Eddy intakes utilizing AFR or CJ gaskets.

AFR heads are on STD port centers so CJ port center intakes like the victor are a no go.



SJ
used 2b RHP


.
 

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Here is a 521 similar to what Scotty mentioned (I borrowed heavily from his input)...
Forged Eagle Crank
Eagle H beam rods @ 6.800”
TFS 290 heads
Comp X4270H
Icon Step Dish Pistons
9.5:1 compression
Edelbrock Perf RPM
Shorty Headers, 3” exh with X pipe
MSD Ready to Run & 6AL

Run/drives awesome... incredible torque off idle and tons of power throughout.
I chose 4.300” stroke & 6.8” rods for lower rod angles/side load... not sure it matters but it made me feel better.
I’ll be installing efi next... just can’t decide on which.
 

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Scotty is the most knowledgeable neighbor I have.I would follow closely his recomedations, and I use rhoades lifters and a little more cam.And I use rotella 20/50 oil,with a tim meyer oil mount.ALWAYS get opinions before you throw money around. b9h
 

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I am building/rebuilding the 460 in my 85 F250 4x4 4spd (with gear vendors overdrive) as a street-daily-towing vehicle seeing most of its life at lower RPM and part throttle highway running under load. I have done a lot of searching and reading of old posts here and elsewhere but most of the builds I find are high RPM high horse racing car applications. I am looking for advice, experience and input from people who have done such High torque low rpm towing builds before. I intend to over build for longevity and durability. I am looking to keep pace with the Diesels (and hopefully get some sort of fuel economy out of it). Please don't tell me I would be better off swapping to a diesel, if that was the goal for this project I wouldn't be asking on a 460 forum.

Here are my intentions so far though they are clearly open to suggestion.

545 Stroker 4.5" stroke, 4.39" bore, 6.7" rod
Fully balanced
Forged crank
full floating wrist pins
Fluidampr or TCI rattler harmonic balancer
Gapless piston rings
Pistons are subject to compression ratio and valve clearance concerns based on cam profile.
I was always under the impression that forged pistons were not for street use, but that seems to be the common suggestion, has this philosophy changed?

Pump gas friendly compression ratio. ( I will likely always run premium but the varying and poor quality of todays gasoline as well as detonation are concerns)

Trick Flow Power Port 290 aluminum cylinder heads, ARP studs
Edelbrock heads were considered but the trick flows seem better on the exhaust side and combustion chamber design. I am not married to this head selection, but most of the other popular aluminum heads (cobra Jet, P-51, AFR) are geared toward high rpm use. I do not want to port and rebuild factory cast cylinder heads and end up with new aluminum head money tied up in old cast heads.

Edelbrock Pro-Flo 4 fuel injection
Is this single plane manifold setup going to be a problem for port velocity at lower rpms? Edelbrock Performer (not RPM) intake was heavily suggested for the lower rpm high torque build for higher port velocity and that dual plane design differs greatly from the single plane manifold Edelbrock uses for their Injection setup. Also I am uncertain of the Performer intakes ability to adequately feed this displacement. The techs at Edelbrock said the positioning of the injectors in their system eliminated the need for the dual plane design but I am skeptical of that answer.

MSD 6AL spark box (if compatible with Edelbrock ProFlo 4 distributor)
Timing?
Spark plugs?
High Volume oil pump

Hydraulic roller camshaft
In reading older posts on such builds Comp Cams #34-232-4 XM262H (262/[email protected]" - 218/[email protected]" - .514"/.524" lift - 112 separation) was suggested, however that was a smaller displacement build, that is not a roller cam, and that post was about 10 years ago so I am not sure where to go with cam selection from there. I do not have to pass smog so an aggressive cam without pollution equipment considerations is acceptable, however I do want some vacuum, low rpm throttle response, idle quality, cold weather manners and the truck is equipped with A/C. Daily driving is possible so I don't want it to be a pain to drive.

full roller rockers (what rocker arm ratio should I be using here?)

Stainless ceramic coated exhaust headers.
What primary diameter should I run?
Long tube, shorty, tri Y, or something different for this application?
20+ years ago Flowmaster used to offer some slip on 4-2-1 collectors that I had used with much success but I can no longer find them available anywhere and they only work on long tube headers.

True Dual exhaust (3"?) with X pipe and high flow mufflers

What temp thermostat?
Also, I know in the Diesel world eliminating the engine driven fan and going all electric is not done because the electric fans cannot produce enough airflow to keep up with the cooling needs of the diesels. Is that also the case with a big gas engine in this type of application or can I successfully run electric fans only and eliminate the engine driven fan?

Thank you in advance, I look forward to every ones experience and input.
I prefer the stock dual plane intake it’s better than after market for torque I also am using d3ve-a2a heads but nice set of aluminum ones eg. kaase heads are great it’s your call.
A mild rv cam is sufficient oh and on the exhaust side of the heads d3ve if you use them is port the exhaust side other than that I run a Holley 650 I have my build sheet if you are interested. Good luck.👍
 
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