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Discussion Starter #1
What would you change on the standard 460 efi build if not held back by the constraints of the factory efi, but kept the (f3) efi heads/intake? For obvious reasons there doesn't appear to be headers for early head/e4od combinations. I plan on buying the banks headers.

I'm swapping the stock eec out and going to a megasquirt based controller. It sounds like the main drawback to the eec is cam selection, but is there any other optimization left on the table due to the Ford system? I'll be running a wideband in addition. I already have to tow with 91/93, so I'd at least like to have something to show for it.

I'd like to see mid to high 500's in the tq department, and move the range up a little higher. My truck falls on its face at highway speeds but honestly around town it does fine. I cruise around 2300 in od, 3k in 3rd.
 

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L&L makes headers
1.75” for 1991-97 EFI trucks with Stock heads or CJ heads.

Mad Dog makes 2” headers for the same CJ heads .

Google
Hot Rod Hauler build Oct.2012
 

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Discussion Starter #3
L&L makes headers
1.75” for 1991-97 EFI trucks with Stock heads or CJ heads.

Mad Dog makes 2” headers for the same CJ heads .

Google
Hot Rod Hauler build Oct.2012

Hmmm.. Thanks for the info. I never even thought to check L&L. Mad dog only seems to offer fender well exit. The L&L could be an option.

The 545 build is a bit further than I wanted to go, but their 1.231 lb/ft per cu inch would put me right where I want to be. I get horrendous quotes on rebuilding heads around here, aftermarket heads were my first instinct.
 

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We do a 502" EFI 460 based combo that works with the OEM ecm.
26# accel injectors
Adjustable FPR
Better fuel pump modules from Quantum.

An aftermarket EFI with wide-band offers more latitude for cam and power-band changes.


Here is a link:
Feel free to use as a guide.


581 Tq and 436 hp with E7TE heads. F3TE heads are worth about 15 hp and lb ft.




Video of dyno pull:



SJ
used 2b RHP
 

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Discussion Starter #5
What would you be able to squeeze out of it without the cam restriction of the stock sd efi system?
 

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We do a 500 hp 545 inch combo and can get to about 525 to540 with out stupid cam timing. If you need more than that then AFR heads and a T2 intake set up for EFI is the ticket.

The OEM intake is actually pretty good with a bit of work.

Remember that all of the EFI heads have small port runner cross sectional area designed to promote torque at both part throttle and WOT.



SJ
used 2b RHP


.
 

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Swapping to a A9L(P) is a option. Not sure if your harness could be repinned or not, You may have to install a mustang harness. But it would offer SEFI and mass air. If you havent looked into MOATES quarter horse, you may give that a look. I ran a A9L with a moates quarter horse and loved it. You can do alot of things in the factory ford ECM with a quarter horse. (fuel,timing,injector size,injector firing order,injector timing,...) only reason I got rid of it was I had a EEC failure and wanted to get rid of the MAF as I have a turbo. I went with a megasquirt PNP. I really do miss that A9L. However, the megasquirt is a system that easily could grow if you needed to change setups. The megasquirt has auto tune, (fuel curve only) but the factory EEC with moates has the ability to change far more settings and offer better drivability.
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
Swapping to a A9L(P) is a option. Not sure if your harness could be repinned or not, You may have to install a mustang harness. But it would offer SEFI and mass air. If you havent looked into MOATES quarter horse, you may give that a look. I ran a A9L with a moates quarter horse and loved it. You can do alot of things in the factory ford ECM with a quarter horse. (fuel,timing,injector size,injector firing order,injector timing,...) only reason I got rid of it was I had a EEC failure and wanted to get rid of the MAF as I have a turbo. I went with a megasquirt PNP. I really do miss that A9L. However, the megasquirt is a system that easily could grow if you needed to change setups. The megasquirt has auto tune, (fuel curve only) but the factory EEC with moates has the ability to change far more settings and offer better drivability.
I am not even considering sticking with a Ford based system. If I can't get the hang of the megasquirt, which I'm pretty confident I will be able to get a decent handle on, there is always the holley terminator. I like the idea of the megasquirt more than the holley though even if it isn't as polished.

I'm kinda using this truck as a test bed as I also have a turbo 408w ranger in the garage being put together I'll need an efi system for as well.

I'm starting with a microsquirt, and if I can figure it out I'll swap that out to do trans control (either this truck or the other), and upgrade to an MS3 or the pimpxs and add sequential at that point. The micro also is able to be used as an i/o extender via can, so for the minor cost of it there really is nothing to lose.

I've been researching this for quite some time. What kind of setup do you have going?
 

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I am not even considering sticking with a Ford based system. If I can't get the hang of the megasquirt, which I'm pretty confident I will be able to get a decent handle on, there is always the holley terminator. I like the idea of the megasquirt more than the holley though even if it isn't as polished.

I'm kinda using this truck as a test bed as I also have a turbo 408w ranger in the garage being put together I'll need an efi system for as well.

I'm starting with a microsquirt, and if I can figure it out I'll swap that out to do trans control (either this truck or the other), and upgrade to an MS3 or the pimpxs and add sequential at that point. The micro also is able to be used as an i/o extender via can, so for the minor cost of it there really is nothing to lose.

I've been researching this for quite some time. What kind of setup do you have going?
The megasquirt/tuner studio can be a learning curve, as is the moates/binary editor. I learned on binary editor so it wasnt as steep of a curve. Biggest thing is knowing your spark requirements. The tuning software will auto tune your fuel tables, but can not adjust spark. You can cheat a little by looking at a EEC spark table and use that as a starting point. Go over to eectuning.org and look around. Gobs of info over there.

I have a 357w with a single 78mm turbonetics turbo. Getting ready to switch to E-85. Thats one plus about mega squirt. You can install a fuel composition sensor, as opposed to the EEC/banary editor, where you are stuck with running just 93 or E-85. No inbetween.

FWIW, the EEC and binary editor can control transmissions as well.

The megasquirt has tons of support. Dont be afraid to try it. Just dont plan on installing it and driving it to work after the weekend.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
I've already got a micro, a Spartan2 w/b, and the rest of the hardware. I'm going to be doing a temp harness so I can switch back and forth between the stock eec and the micro until I get it drivable. I also am able to see live data from the stocker so I can get a start on the timing table. I've been reading everything I can for the last year, but I'm going to have to dive in and figure it out.

The last thing I need to figure out before I dive into the swap is getting my exhaust leaks figured out. I've had the manifolds off a half dozen times, machined, gasket/no gasket, rtv, etc and they continue to leak!

Which is why the header question came out. I had intended on just buying the Banks and being done with it, but I'm not going to buy $1400 headers and then have to swap them out again!
 

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I also am able to see live data from the stocker so I can get a start on the timing table
Keeping in-mind that the ignition timing must be re-tuned for any changes from fuel to hardware, and a "copied" timing curve is only a place to begin initial tuning; below is a link to using TunerStudio to create a factory-equivalent timing table from shop manual numbers. The system is similar-yet-different to MS (Speeduino), but uses the same TunerStudio tuning interface. Hope that helps.
Creating a stock-equivalent Spark Table from factory service manual specifications
Direct link: Ignition timing for datsun j13 engine - Speeduino
 

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Thanks for the link and the info. The timing table is probably the area I'm going to struggle in the most.
 
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