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Discussion Starter #1
I'm trying to get into hand loading and have many questions, mainly on the bullets themselves. I have a 25-06 that I want to be my ranch rifle. I will never shoot a bear or a 300 pound deer (we have puny deer around here), but want to make sure that I can take a medium sized hog or small to medium sized deer. The main thing I want is a hot round that will reach out and be relatively accurate out to 300 yards- to shoot coyotes, stray dogs, buzzards (they get after baby claves), etc. I was thinking of going with a 100 grain bullet because I get it going faster and not drop as much, but wanted to make sure that if I see a buck out about 200 yards I could be confident of the load. I know I could go with a 117 grain bullet, but again, the smaller the less drop, etc. I also want to make sure that if I shoot a coyote at 75 yards that it will kill him and not just go stright through without any expansion. I know that the faster the bullet is not always the most accurate. I know they make some new bullets that are awesome, but I can't afford the high dollar ones. I have spent hours researching different bullets and I am more confused than ever.

This is what I have been looking at:

Combined Technology Ballistic Silvertip 115 Grain Boat Tail (its 115 grain, but its a ballistic tip and boattail (higher BC))
http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=734301#video

Remington Core-Lokt 100 Grain Pointed Soft Point (i have used these before and like them, but that was for pure knock-down)
http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=398344


I know there was one more, but I can't remember it right now. Can I even have all the things I'm looking for?

-relatively low drop
-good for coyotes, but big enough to take a deer or small hog (at any angle, etc)
-relatively low price


thanks

stephen
 
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85 GR Ballistic Tips always worked well for me in my .25-06

Lighter = Faster / Flatter trajectory (Weatherby theory Speed Kills)

With all the smaller stuff your wanting to shoot you don't need a heavy bullet at 300 yards an 85 grain will have plenty of energy at that range.
 

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cougar1969 said:
I use some 75gr and some 85gr and have some 100gr for shooting 1000 yards all work great...


Randy
I don't think I would even attempt a shot over 400 yards. The trajectory tables show like a 50 inch drop over 500 yards. How do you do that? Am I looking up the wrong data?
 

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pay attention to where zero is. If you move it out you can be low closer up and not have as much drop further down range. 50inches sounds like a lot.

Used to use this trick when I shot my 44 and 22 in IHMSA competitions many moons ago
 

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skosler said:
I thought ballistic tips at that speed would just blow up and not penetrate. What would they do to a 150-200 pound hog at 150 yards? I wish they made a hornady SST in a 100 grain
http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=378901
Um, anger it, really. You could wound it severely, if you do a lung shot or a belly shot, but hogs have thick cartilage around the chest, so I wouldn't use that caliber and that grain further than 100 yards, really, on a hog. A ballistic tip is great for game like deer, but hogs and bear need a deeper penetrating bullet.

You may be asking too much of the bullet/gun. Small, accurate and flat shooting is on one end of the spectrum. Heavy, deadly and penetrating is on the other side. Find out where you want to compromise, or do what I do. Get more than one rifle.
 

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skosler said:
cougar1969 said:
I use some 75gr and some 85gr and have some 100gr for shooting 1000 yards all work great...


Randy
I don't think I would even attempt a shot over 400 yards. The trajectory tables show like a 50 inch drop over 500 yards. How do you do that? Am I looking up the wrong data?
Nope, not the wrong data... Just lotsa practice... :wink:
I'm a heavy for caliber guy, I too shoot a 25/06 but I lean toward the 117 Sierra's or 117 Hornady's... Trust me when I say, you won't have ANY problems with either of those not expanding on small stuff like coyotes or even ground squirrels... But you'll also have plenty ther to shoot the toughest hogs and the biggest deer... An old timer named Bob Milek was a staff writer for Guns and Ammo (before losing a battle with cancer) was a huge 25/06 fan and took a lot of animals from varmints to even Elk with the Junior .25...

If you're handloading your own, I would start with either of the 2 bullets mentioned above, and a good stiff load of H4831 - Hodgdon's still relatively new Retumbo powder whatever shoots best in your gun and get down to business... If you don't have a chronograph, I would suggest testing your loads at 200-300 yds. That way you'll be able to tell which loads are the most consistant in your rifle... Any load can be accurate at 100 yds. BUT!!! Only an accurate load will shoot accurately downrange... :wink: And much to popular belief, after you find your load then go to 100 yds. and zero it 3" high... Your highest trajectory is going to be around 200-225 yds. (only about 4" or so) and you'll be able to hold center mass out to 300 yds...

If you need anything else I'll PM you my #... Feel free to call anytime...




Doug... 8)
 

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Doug, I completely agree that .25-06 can take anything from groundhogs to elk, but would you really shoot that at a hog at 150 yards and up? I just think that may be asking too much of that bullet at that distance on that type of game.
 

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My father-in-law is an elk guide here in Montana and when I was guiding for him, I've seen him take Elk from 30-40 yds in the timber to 400 plus yds. with the 117 Hornady's without fail... I'd put 'em downrange with the same loads on anything but big Griz... But I did forget to add before, it's all in your confidence level... :wink:




Doug... 8)
 

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ThndrChkn said:
My father-in-law is an elk guide here in Montana and when I was guiding for him, I've seen him take Elk from 30-40 yds in the timber to 400 plus yds. with the 117 Hornady's without fail... I'd put 'em downrange with the same loads on anything but big Griz... But I did forget to add before, it's all in your confidence level... :wink:




Doug... 8)
Well, again, not doubting the distance for Elk, but hogs are different. I know of hogs taken with small caliber rifle bullets lodged in its chest area. The cartilage there is over 1/2 inch thick, to protect it from other hogs. Keep in mind these things charge each other with those huge teeth bared.

I worked in a firearms store for years, and to anyone hunting hog, we would recommend .30 cal and higher, and not at a great distance (swamps, which is where most of my hog hunting is done, eliminates any long shots).

So, Elk, yes, 400 yards, yes. Hog? mmmmmm, I'd use bigger caliber, shorter distance, different bullet for deeper penetration.
 

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Oh yeah, I understand that... If I was hunting strictly hogs, and only had (in this case a 25/06) I would use a Barnes Triple Shock... Of course these are more expensive but they're ONLY expensive if you plan to shoot a lot... But, if you're only gonna shoot a couple hundred rds/yr that would be my choice....





Doug... 8)
 

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I REALLLY envy you for guiding in Montana. Hell, just for hunting in Montana. Maybe someday . . .

Well, just transitioning from hunting in Louisiana to hunting here in Tennessee, on top of Cagle Mountain, has been a butt-kicker, so Montanta would be an even greater challenge. Dang deer are like billy goats here. I, however, am not, but I am in great shape come bow season!
 

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Click on my signature picture and you can look through my Putfile pics at some of the critters we've taken the last couple seasons... Plus I think there are a few groups I've shot in there as well...



Doug... 8)
 

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I too am a fan of the 25/06. I don't own one but am confident in it's ability to nail down a lot of critters. Saying that a heavy, large caliber bullet is what you need for hogs. They are as close to dangerous game as one will find in the bottom half of the union. Friends who have hunted them say they get real mad when shot with the sub caliber stuff. 7mm Mag is the starting point for a hog gun according to these guys. I wouldn't think twice about shooting one with the .25 if it was my only choice though, just use the heaviest bullet that you can use, and make it a stout heavy constructed one. I am a huge fan of Hornady, and think they make some of the best bullets out there. I am biased though as they are located about an hour from where I live. :lol:
 

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Discussion Starter #16
thanks Doug. I'll give you a call tomorrow. You said you liked the Hornadys. Are you talking about those SST bullets? They seem pretty impressive and are relatively cheap.

I have taken numerous hogs with my .270 I have seem my neighbor lay down a 125 pound sow in one shot with his .223! (about 65 yards). I know what you are saying about those hogs, they are tough. The biggest I have shot with my .270 is about 275 pounds at 90-100 yards (130 grain core-lokt). It went down after about 50 feet. The bigger hogs around here are boars and I really don't care if they run a little. Any boar over 125 pounds I just drag off and let the buzzards take care of them. If they run too far, then I don't have to drag :)

I knew I was asking a lot out of one load and knew I would have to compromise. I'm just trying to figure out my best option. Good on coyotes, deer and small hogs (<150 pounds) and relatively accurate up to 350 yards.

Thanks for all your info and help guys 8)
 

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FE_rex said:
pay attention to where zero is. If you move it out you can be low closer up and not have as much drop further down range. 50inches sounds like a lot.

Used to use this trick when I shot my 44 and 22 in IHMSA competitions many moons ago
What class did you shoot? I have a group of guys here that still shoot IHMSA, and I like to go and play once in a while. Here is what I use to embarass them once in a while. 7mmX .308

Top one. Rem XP100
 

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I'm still a fan of Hornady bullets... I took a 6x6 bull a few years back with my .300 win mag loaded with 180 sp's @ a measuerd 729 yds. and my brother has been there numerous occasions when I put the hammer down on a few White-tails at 500+ yds... I even took a Muley buck @ 836 yds. with that load... I hunted with Barnes Triple Shock X Bullets the last 2 seasons, and with exception to cost, all I can say is WOW!!! My son took an elk with my .300 win mag and the 168 TSX at 300 yds walking away and he took her through the length of her body (43") and we found the bullet on the far side shoulder, it still weighed 168 gr. But you talk about drop, she covered her own tracks she dropped so fast...





Doug... 8)
 

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schmitty said:
What class did you shoot? I have a group of guys here that still shoot IHMSA, and I like to go and play once in a while. Here is what I use to embarass them once in a while. 7mmX .308
I used to shoot production revolver with a 10-1/2" Ruger Super Blackhawk. A couple months before they closed the range, I also shot a 10" 22 Mk2 Ruger - forget what class it was. Regularly shot high 30's close to 40 in the creedmore and usually shot 32- 35 standing - those turkeys were the toughest target. Range closed in the late 80's. If you can pull that long creepy trigger of a production Ruger with hot loads, you have trigger control!!!!! I swear that thing felt like it was 20 miles long on the last five shots.
 

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That's too bad that the range closed down as the IHMSA is a fun game to play. My personal best was 39 Creedmoor. I've never shot standing for a score. Had a blackhawk too and it made a very fast exit from my ownership of it because the triggers are not good for accuracy. Skosler, didn't mean to hijack here, but I don't often get to meet others who have done IHMSA.
 
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