460 Ford Forum banner

1 - 20 of 39 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hi everyone. I need help and I am no expert mechanic... I neglected our 1984 Motorhome with an E-350 7.5 V8 ford 460 engine. It always ran fine, then I parked it while I finished our home(5 years), starting it a couple of times a year, until one day it wouldn't start again. I have read a lot about what needs to be done in this case. Engine froze so after several applications of Lucas Marvel oil(I think is the name) I slowly turned it by hand until it was free. Replaced all spark plugs and starter(it was dead). Now here is my problem: with the new starter, engine will crank slower than normal WITHOUT the plugs installed. With the plugs installed it won't. You can see the belts attempting to move but it seems like the starter doesn't have enough power or something else is happening. I cleaned ground contacts at the chassis and the battery is not an issue(I am using my truck to jump it, even applying power directly to the starter bypassing everything else. Are starters rated for specific engines depending on size of engine? I purchased mine at advance auto, it looks identical to original except it is not made by Motorcraft.
Your comments will be greatly appreciated.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
355 Posts
Sounds like your engine might be partially froze up, the starter might not be able to spin the motor. I might try shooting some anti-seize oil into each spark plug hole and letting it set for a day or so and trying again. I'm sure your local auto parts store will be able to suggest a product, another thing is I don't think jumping from your truck might not give you enough juice to spin the motor.
Good luck,
J.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
399 Posts
HI when you say it froze which do you mean? No oil froze up or winter frieze?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
I guess the pistons froze for lack of oil. That is when I removed the plugs and injected some Marvel oil into each cylinder, then turned it by hand until it moved freely.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
399 Posts
HI OK,, your going to need more than putting oil in the clyinders. the barrings are most likely shot .. going to take a rebuild sorry.. When you run out of oil its the barrings that freeze up not so much the pistons..
good luck
tim
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
so I understand things correctly I want to make certain we understand each other. The engine never ran out of oil, the oil was in the pan but since the cylinders did not get lubricated often because it was sitting for a while, the engine ceased. Will this situation cause what you are describing?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
so I understand things correctly I want to make certain we understand each other. The engine never ran out of oil, the oil was in the pan but since the cylinders did not get lubricated often because it was sitting for a while, the engine ceased. Will this situation cause what you are describing?
Honestly, it just sounds like everything is stiff from sitting, especially since it soft seized. When I got my '79 town car, it had been sitting with the timing cover off for 15 years. If I were you, I wouldn't crank it anymore till doing this:

When I got my town car, I tried cranking it and it made horrific screeching metallic noises. So, I took the oil pan off, cleaned the bugs and sludge out, put it back on, filled the crankcase with diesel, took the dizzy out, and hooked up a corded drill to the oil pump shaft and spun it for several minutes, then turned the motor 90*, rinse and repeat. Once I felt all the dirt was out I changed the diesel out for oil, and repeated the process.

While it may not be necessary for you to take the pan off, or even use diesel, you may want to take the dizzy out and spin the oil pump shaft with a drill to get the fluids moving throughout the motor, and create that oil film barrier to help keep the dry bearings from destroying themselves.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
39 Posts
you may want to take the dizzy out and spin the oil pump shaft with a drill to get the fluids moving throughout the motor, and create that oil film barrier to help keep the dry bearings from destroying themselves.
I would try this like a fresh motor...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
399 Posts
so I understand things correctly I want to make certain we understand each other. The engine never ran out of oil, the oil was in the pan but since the cylinders did not get lubricated often because it was sitting for a while, the engine ceased. Will this situation cause what you are describing?
Ok the piston's have NOTHING to do with oiling the motor .. anytime the motor turns it turns the pump that moves the oil thru pasages to all the barrings. The pistons just create the exploisions that move the crank, that moves the timing chain that moves the cam that moves the oil pump, the lifters and turns the distribuitor. Oil splashed around by the crank and cam splash oil onto the cylinder walls and the oil ring and the other rings wipe the cylinder clean or it would smoke from burning the oil off the walls.
good luck
tim
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
500 Posts
Replaced all spark plugs and starter(it was dead). Now here is my problem: with the new starter, engine will crank slower than normal WITHOUT the plugs installed. With the plugs installed it won't.
(I am using my truck to jump it, even applying power directly to the starter bypassing everything else. Are starters rated for specific engines depending on size of engine? I purchased mine at advance auto, it looks identical to original except it is not made by Motorcraft.
Your comments will be greatly appreciated.
When you have a bad battery and you add jumper cables, some (maybe most) of the power from the Jumpers is going into the bad battery. If the bad battery has shorted cells, you will never get the engine to crank.

Of course when you installed the spark plug you are now fighting the engines compression in addition to the normal drag of the piston rings and rotating parts.

You need to get a new battery. Then you will be able to crank the engine at the proper speed. Even taking the old battery out temporarily hooking up the truck battery (by itself) is a good choice.

BTW, if you did not drain out the old gas, it it bad by now and you will never get the engine started. You can try to start the engine using fresh gas in a 5 gallon can and running your fuel pickup line to that (However by now your carb is probably gummed up so you wil need to clean that too).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
850 Posts
Sounds like you have a battery or cable issue. Your + and - cables might have corroded while sitting and now have to much resistance to let your full battery power get to the starter. Also, check your ignition timing and make sure it isn't too advanced.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
Thanks for your reply. Spinning the dizzy on a town car sure sounds easier than on a van chassis. I do not see how a drill will fit in there but I will try.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
You need to get a new battery. Then you will be able to crank the engine at the proper speed. Even taking the old battery out temporarily hooking up the truck battery (by itself) is a good choice.

BTW, if you did not drain out the old gas, it it bad by now and you will never get the engine started. You can try to start the engine using fresh gas in a 5 gallon can and running your fuel pickup line to that (However by now your carb is probably gummed up so you wil need to clean that too).
I was going to try that today; thanks for the advice.
I do realize that gas will also be an issue but I need to get the cranking going before I tackle the fuel section...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
500 Posts
Thanks for your reply. Spinning the dizzy on a town car sure sounds easier than on a van chassis. I do not see how a drill will fit in there but I will try.
If you want to do this (I/m not sure its necessary) you would pull out the distributor and spinning the oil pump driveshaft. You can use a 1/4" drive extension with a 5/16" socket taped on the end to spin that with a drill, but you have to cut the female end off of the extension to get it fit in the drill chuck. They also make a "priming tool for a drill" but I had one of those priming tool break the tip off will priming my new engine build (the drill can put too much torque on the shaft) so I suggest you start off real slow with the drill speed, or better yet get a priming tool with a hardened shaft. If your talking about hood clearance, then maybe a 3/8" right angle drill will get in there (you can rent those from HD and such)

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/oes-27062?seid=srese1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIleP8mfHa5QIVEI3ICh2D5AG3EAQYASABEgLBJ_D_BwE
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
39 Posts
Thanks for your reply. Spinning the dizzy on a town car sure sounds easier than on a van chassis. I do not see how a drill will fit in there but I will try.
Plan B is a cheap weed sprayer/pump with some oil in it. connect hose to oil sender port on front or back of block. Pump, rotate crank, repeat. Chuck sprayer when done. Some people prime new engines this way. Have not done it myself.

Regardless of the oiling, verify the starter electrical system. Measure the volt drop from battery to starter when cranking. Measure DC current if you have amp clamp. post numbers.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
8,637 Posts
Will the engine crank with the plugs in and Ignition disabled?



SJ
used 2b RHP



:D
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Discussion Starter #19
If you want to do this (I/m not sure its necessary) you would pull out the distributor and spinning the oil pump driveshaft. You can use a 1/4" drive extension with a 5/16" socket taped on the end to spin that with a drill, but you have to cut the female end off of the extension to get it fit in the drill chuck. They also make a "priming tool for a drill" but I had one of those priming tool break the tip off will priming my new engine build (the drill can put too much torque on the shaft) so I suggest you start off real slow with the drill speed, or better yet get a priming tool with a hardened shaft. If your talking about hood clearance, then maybe a 3/8" right angle drill will get in there (you can rent those from HD and such)
I do own a 3/8" right angle drill adapter but I keep reading everywhere that you need a 1/2" drill to do this. Is it because of the amount of torque? If so, putting a 3/8" right angle adapter on a 1/2" drill may not be a good idea. Has anyone ever tried this?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Discussion Starter #20
Plan B is a cheap weed sprayer/pump with some oil in it. connect hose to oil sender port on front or back of block. Pump, rotate crank, repeat. Chuck sprayer when done. Some people prime new engines this way. Have not done it myself.

Regardless of the oiling, verify the starter electrical system. Measure the volt drop from battery to starter when cranking. Measure DC current if you have amp clamp. post numbers.
I like the idea but I do not know where the oil sender is... And I do not have a clamp meter
 
1 - 20 of 39 Posts
Top