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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
i have a '96 F350 Dually with a 7.5L that i rebuilt and i have an issue with it. it runs too warm. it has a new cam that is slightly larger than factory. nothing major, just an improvement on low end torque. the crank was turned, rods were trued, new pistons and rings .030 over. i installed reman factory heads with comp cam valve springs installed. i took the bare engine block to a shop to have it cleaned. the block was stood up on a turntable and a 4 nozzle pressure washer washed the block for some specified amount of time. i did not know till the engine was inside my truck and was having issues that they didnt put it in acid or whatever it is called. my dad called it acid but i dont know. im not sure what the technical term is, but when i had the engine on the stand and was building it, i noticed that there was white chunks of a rock substance inside the water jackets. i broke it out as much as i could and kept turning the engine block upside down to dump it out, but im not sure if there is anything else in there. i installed the completed engine that i spent around $5500.00 on and burned in the cam according to the instructions from comp cams. since i built and installed the engine, it has ran too warm. not to the point of overheating, but that is because i would not allow it to over heat. everything on it is brand new i mean as far as water pump and stuff. in diagnosing this issue, the shop that i had clean the block and install the rotating assembly asked if i had installed a head gasket backwards. i told them no, but they made me doubt myself, so i removed the heads. both gaskets were indeed on correctly. the next thing was the backing plate on the water pump. it is visible so it is easy to see that i did not forget to install it. next was to replace the radiator. it had a 2 core that was less than a year old, but i installed a solid aluminum 3 core radiator with 2 electric fans that sound like a tornado under the hood. it didnt change anything. oh, also i have installed 3 different brand new motorcraft 192 degree thermostats as well. i set the timing to 10 degrees BTDC with the lug unplugged and verified the timing multiple times. i tested the coolant system to see if there was any combustion gases present, and there was not. that is everything that i can think of. i am starting to think that i should remove the engine and take it down to the block and find a place that will submerge it in acid to clean the water jackets, but i dont know. im not sure what to do at this point. any suggestions would be welcome. i enjoyed driving that truck and do miss it. thanks for any suggestions.
 

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Hi.. Sorry for your troubles. It's always frustrating after you spent a bucket load of money only to be disappointed by things like this.

What gauge are you looking at that says it's too warm? Stock gauge or an aftermarket? Also where on the motor is the water temperature sensor? Also what is too warm? Are you seeing 230 degrees or 205?

Can you tell it is running warm when you are driving it or is the only indication that it is hot on the gauge? Any loss of power when it heats up? Do you have the stock fan shroud on? Also how many miles were on the original clutch fan? Those things can and do go bad.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Hi.. Sorry for your troubles. It's always frustrating after you spent a bucket load of money only to be disappointed by things like this.

What gauge are you looking at that says it's too warm? Stock gauge or an aftermarket? Also where on the motor is the water temperature sensor? Also what is too warm? Are you seeing 230 degrees or 205?

Can you tell it is running warm when you are driving it or is the only indication that it is hot on the gauge? Any loss of power when it heats up? Do you have the stock fan shroud on? Also how many miles were on the original clutch fan? Those things can and do go bad.
ok let me answer this. the gauge im looking at is the gauge on the dash and the infrared thermometer in my hand when i aim it at the water outlet that houses the thermostat. the gauge is stock. the coolant temp sensor is mounted inside the crossover that is part of the intake manifold. the temp sensor is new as well. when i say it's running too warm, i am referring to the coolant temperature. the temperature i have seen was as high as 240 degrees Fahrenheit. i wont let it go any higher. i dont want to do damage to the engine. it will run too warm sitting still idling or driving down the road. i dont remember having a loss of power, but the valves were clattering when it was running too warm. this problem occurs with the factory shroud and a clutch fan or with the dual electric fans i have on it now. as for miles on clutch fan, it is brand new and it is the third brand new one that i have installed. once i installed the engine and was having this trouble, i thought that maybe the new clutch i installed may have been bad, so i replaced it, and when the problem persisted, i replaced it again, just to be sure. at the current moment, i have two 14" fans in a shroud that covers the engine side of the radiator. it doesnt matter because this problem was occurring with the factory shroud and the clutch fan. i installed the electric fans thinking that because they mount so close to the radiator, and the fact that they move so much more air due to the high rpm of the fans, they would keep it cooler. this has not been the case. the engine still runs too warm.
 

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Could there be an issue with the catalytic converter? Maybe bump the timing up a few degrees, really depends on how much "bigger" the camshaft is as compared to stock. 10-12 degrees BTDC, with SPOUT connector removed, is about tops for a stock EFI 460. Was the camshaft degreed at the time the engine was assembled? Hope you get it figured out.
 

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I agree with playing with the timing a bit to see if it helps. I know I've made my headers glow red before. ...ooppss...

If that doesn't work I think you need to figure out how much water the pump is pushing through the engine. Could be not enough... Could be too much. I have heard of (but never experienced) overheating problems when the water pump flows to much water. If there is no thermostat present it can push the water so fast it doesn't stay in the radiator long enough to cool it. What degree thermostat are you running anyway?

EDIT: I just went back up and saw the 192 degree thermostat. Maybe pump isn't flowing enough for whatever reason.. Check coolant flow.
 

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If it gets hot after it warms up really good and really when it's on the road but not so much idling... I'd look into the converters being stopped up.. Also what can happen is if the converter starts breaking up it can gob off the muffler and stop it up as well..
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Could there be an issue with the catalytic converter? Maybe bump the timing up a few degrees, really depends on how much "bigger" the camshaft is as compared to stock. 10-12 degrees BTDC, with SPOUT connector removed, is about tops for a stock EFI 460. Was the camshaft degreed at the time the engine was assembled? Hope you get it figured out.
i doubt there is an issue with the catalytic converter. it is a high flow magnaflow catalytic converter and it was on the truck for 10k miles before the engine swap. as far as timing goes. no the cam wasnt degreed and its not that big. however, i did remove the spout while timing the ignition. i have moved it forward and backward as much as 4 degrees both ways. i even pulled the timing case cover and advanced and retarded the cam timing 2 degrees forward and 2 degrees backward then finally putting it back to neutral again. camshaft isnt much bigger than factory. mainly i changed it to move the torque curve lower on the rpm power band. the factory engine was starting to run warm before i pulled it. in fact that was the reason i pulled it. i was thinking that because it had 265k miles on it, that maybe the rings were worn out and i was getting compression blow by and the oil maybe was getting too hot thereby increasing the coolant temp in the liquid to liquid oil cooler that is located where the oil filter goes. when i built this engine, i checked that oil cooler by blowing air thru the oil passages and the coolant passages, and there wasnt any blockages. although, now that i think about it, the tests i done does not necessarily mean that it isnt blocked, just that it wasnt clogged up completely. something to think about i guess. but im not sure how i would see if it is blocked at all, and i feel that if i just ran out and bought one, i would be just throwing money at the situation. but, i have been doing that anyway i guess. i i do like that truck, and now that i cant find engine oil for my 08 F250 SD, not to mention diesel fuel prices being thru the roof, i would like to drive this truck again.
 

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Blinker fluid? I got nothing...

Edit... Maybe EGR or something from the emissions carp making it lean out and run hot is it??? Check spark plugs??
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Blinker fluid? I got nothing...

Edit... Maybe EGR or something from the emissions carp making it lean out and run hot is it??? Check spark plugs??
the EGR valve, the regulator, and the feedback sensor are all brand new. the spark plugs are brand new E3 plugs and my spark plug wires are Taylor 8.5mm or 9.5mm. im cant remember which. i have california emissions, so there isnt a smog pump on it. also, because i have california emissions, it has the vacuum only egr valve. it doesnt have that electric/vacuum one. whatever this issue is, it was starting to do it with the old engine i removed. that is the reason i removed it. the old engine was running fine, just started to run too warm. i didnt use anything from the old engine either except the radiator. i replaced that when i started throwing money at this situation. it had a 2 core plastic tank radiator in it that was about 1 yr old. i replaced it with a 3 core aluminum tank radiator. not sure what to do from here. just hoping someone has seen this and can help me solve this before i pull the engine back down to the bare block again.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Is the spring in your bottom radiator hose? Check for the hose trying to collapse.
no, there isn't a spring in the radiator hose. I have 2 lower hoses. a small L shaped hose that goes to the water pump from the oil cooler, and one that goes from the bottom radiator port to the oil cooler. the engine will run warm if I crank it up and let it sit and idle. it will also run warm if I crank it up and go down the road in it. when I cranked it and let it idle, I checked the bottom hose every time to make sure it wasn't collapsed, and it wasn't, yet the engine went as high as 240 degrees. and that temp was measured with an infrared thermometer at the water outlet. there wasn't a spring in the old hoses when I removed them from the factory engine either. as I said in a previous reply, I pulled the factory engine because of this problem and did not use anything off the old engine with the exception of the radiator. it was only a year old and was a factory spec 2 core towing package radiator with plastic tanks on it. i replaced it anyway with a 3 core all aluminum radiator. needless to say it did not fix the issue. im thinking of just removing the oil cooler and putting an liquid to air oil cooler on it instead. that way maybe the coolant will flow better. not sure, just a thought right now.
 

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K, I saw that you changed out the converter about 10k before you did the engine. Was the engine getting hot then the reason for new converter?. If so did you change out the muffler as well? It could be gobbed up with pieces from the old converter. I've seen it happen more often than you think.. One way to find out, unhook the muffler and see if it still gets hot. Maybe even unhook it ahead of the converter to remove all restriction in the exhaust and see if it still gets hot. If so you know what's causing it..
 

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Not Rocket science , PUT the spring in the lower hose. Personally I would NEVER let my rebuilt engine run without rodding out the radiator.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
K, I saw that you changed out the converter about 10k before you did the engine. Was the engine getting hot then the reason for new converter?. If so did you change out the muffler as well? It could be gobbed up with pieces from the old converter. I've seen it happen more often than you think.. One way to find out, unhook the muffler and see if it still gets hot. Maybe even unhook it ahead of the converter to remove all restriction in the exhaust and see if it still gets hot. If so you know what's causing it..
no i did not replace the catalytic convert because of this issue. i replaced it because i want more sound. you know, that beautiful V8 sound. i also replaced the muffler. i installed a Flowmaster series 50 on it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Not Rocket science , PUT the spring in the lower hose. Personally I would NEVER let my rebuilt engine run without rodding out the radiator.
1) i wouldnt know where to get the spring since the bottom hose doesnt come with one in it. 2) the radiator i took out of the truck was less than or about 1yr old. 3) the radiator i installed is an all aluminum 3 core brand spanking new out of the box.
 
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