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514 aluminum rod engine making around 825 H.P. with approximately 150 1/8th mile runs. Things did not look too good. The walking was just as bad as the last block which did not have a girdle. Looks like anything making much power will require an SVO block.
Later,
Mark J.

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Gary
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12.13.226.18 RPM?
No score for this post December 18 2001, 8:26 AM

What was your peek rpm.

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Mark J.
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63.24.6.175 RPM
No score for this post December 18 2001, 12:46 PM

Lenco car, shift 7-7200. Alcohol, no power adders.

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Gary
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24.177.87.172 milodon
No score for this post January 2 2002, 11:05 AM

I'm going to run the milodon 4-bolt caps on a regular 460 block...might try them... with splayed outer bolts...

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RJP
(no login)
205.188.200.200 Correct me if I'm wrong but....
No score for this post January 2 2002, 2:08 PM

Aren't Milodon caps cast iron or steel? And wouldn't it make more sense to run a steel billet cap than a cast cap? Just wondering.....

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Brad
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216.106.36.87 Any experience with aftermarket caps..
No score for this post December 18 2001, 9:07 PM

in a engine of simular output? cast or billet

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Mark J.
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63.24.6.181 Caps
No score for this post December 19 2001, 1:50 AM

Sorry can't help you here. After having one of my own engines have the caps walk around we found for us it is cheaper in the long run to go with a race designed block ( by the time you do all the things required to get some life out of a production block you could just about pay for an iron SVO block). Started with iron SVO now use aluminum RDI. Trying to get the guy that ownes the 514 to try the C&C Motorsports aluminum block.

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Rob
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144.134.149.108 RE: Steel caps
No score for this post December 19 2001, 3:42 AM

I have Engine Systems' caps (3 centres only)with stock front and rear caps.My motor on nitrous makes just under 1100hp. Production block, no problems with cap walk at all.I've been running this block for 4 years. Give Jimmy at Engine Systems a call and buy his caps.

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Gary
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12.13.226.12 Cost?
No score for this post December 19 2001, 9:02 AM

How much did Engine Systems charge to put those caps on Your block?

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RJP
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198.81.16.189 2 engines with steel caps
No score for this post December 19 2001, 12:39 PM

I run Pro-Gram's 18deg. splayed steel caps on a 466" engine and Batten's inline bolt steel caps on a 514. No probs with either engine.

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Mark J
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63.24.6.173 Just curious, multiple questions.
No score for this post December 22 2001, 10:24 PM

How many passes did you have on the engines before you inspected & found no problems. How much Timing, compression, max RPM,& type trans do you run. Also fuel of choice.
Thanks in advance for any reply,
Mark J.

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RJP
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198.81.16.176 Some info for you
No score for this post December 24 2001, 3:05 PM

The engines are in boats [flatbottom/v-drive] The 466 is twin-turboed and turns app.7200 rpm and makes about 15 lbs of boost. Only problem I have had with this engine is head gaskets. In the past I ran 50/50 mix of 110 racing and 92 Premium. In the future I'll run 100% 110 racing. C/R is 8.4 to 1. Total timing is set at 34 deg. This engine has been together for 3 years now. The engines in the past have never showed any signs of block walk, fretting or bearing problems. The 514 is naturally asperated [2-850 D/P Holleys] with 12.75 to 1 C/R turns 68-6900 rpm. Total timing is set at 37 deg, it too runs 50/50 fuel mix and never had any problems with this. The engine has only been together for about a year and I haven't torn it down yet to check the bottom end. From past engines in this boat I don't expect any problems with the block, bearings or caps. Unless you are going to run heavy loads of nitrous or alot of boost you should not have any lower-end problems providing you keep the engine from detonating and the engine is properly set up. Hope this helps.

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Mark J.
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63.24.6.181 Apples to Oranges?
No score for this post December 24 2001, 10:03 PM

Just curious again. Our applications here are Lenco drag cars. I run 16.5 to 1 in my 598 with an RDI block so my problems are gone. The 514 we maintain is the one eating stock blocks. After 3 stock blocks he agreed to go with the Sportsman C&C Motorsports block so maybe his problems will be gone. Just wondering, maybe the load characteristics the engines see is different between water & asphalt.
Merry Christmas,
Mark J.

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RJP
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198.81.16.173 As I see it
No score for this post December 25 2001, 3:02 PM

Yes, Apples and oranges. The boat engines do not have to deal with shock loads from waterbox burnouts, dumping the clutch at 4-6k and gear changes. Boat engines have a very hard life but not like that of a dragrace engine. Your engines run for 7-9 seconds at full throttle whereas our engines can and do run at full throttle for minutes at a time. Our engines are built for maximum reliablity first, performance second as its sometime along way back to the ramp if some thing goes wrong. We do not generally use aluminum rods and ultra light weight components in our engines as the typical drag race engine does. If your engine breaks its a simple matter of towing you off the strip and back to the pits, we may have to suffer the embarrasment of Search and Rescue by the Sherriff Dept. or the Coast Guard and they can and sometimes do bill us for their efforts. If I were to do another engine for one of my boats I would consider buying a Motorsport block because the money I spent for the work on the stock block came close to that of the SVO/FRP iron block.

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RJP
(no login)
198.81.16.173 Compresson ratio
No score for this post December 25 2001, 3:24 PM

Mark, I don't deal with a 16.5 to 1 C/R. That in itself is a bearing pounder. When using that much C/R you are in another world with a new set of problems to deal with. [I run diesel engines with much less c/r] You are beyond the limits of any stock block, even a Ford. LOL... Merry Christmas, Bob

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Mark J.
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63.29.25.39 Thanks for perspective
No score for this post December 25 2001, 9:53 PM

Thanks again for your view. I have small children so Christmas was a blast, hope yours' was also. These alcohol engines seem to love the compression without beating the bearings up.
Take care,
Mark J.

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Rob
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144.134.37.84 Caps fitted
No score for this post December 22 2001, 5:37 PM

Gary, don't think I can help much, I live in Australia so my caps were fitted here for approx. $230 U.S.I've seen alot of cap designs for 460's but Engine Systems' are the best choice. Any good machine shop can fit them to your block.

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Gary H.
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24.177.87.172 where?
No score for this post January 2 2002, 11:10 AM

do they have a website? did a search and nothing came up...

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Rob
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144.138.213.178 more info
No score for this post January 4 2002, 1:22 AM

Gary,try typing enginesystems.com in your address bar again it should come up. It's a pretty good site. They're in Tucker, Giorgia. Hope they can help you.

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Mark J.
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63.10.102.223 Cost vs end product
No score for this post December 19 2001, 11:45 PM

Jimmy says to make it live you need the three caps plus pour the block & you still have a stock ie. weak block. At $1900 is the SVO block not the better choice having the capability to go 6.25 on the bore? Both weigh about the same after you pour the stock block. The guys at C&C said that is why they developed their blocks cause the main web area will not stay in tack. Think maybe when you make serious power the block twists, locking down the cam, shearing those cam pins. Talking 900+ HP all the time with no power adders.
Any thoughts?
Later,
Mark J.

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BUDDY T
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64.12.107.181 COST
No score for this post December 20 2001, 12:27 AM

I see why you didn't come out to the shop you was www. Found two broken valve springs and weak springs 175 @ 1.950.

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Brad
(no login)
216.106.36.236 between a rock and a hard place
No score for this post December 20 2001, 8:00 PM

those are good points. I would love to have an svo block. Problem is I will also need a steel crank and good rods. Dont think i can afford them all. If i had to take away one of the three, I would have to pick the block. I am hoping it will live at that level with good prep, but without a steel crank or good rods, i would definatly be pissing my money away. Who knows, maybe i can manage enough money to do it right, and not worry whats gonna come appart first.
BTW, is that cost of the SVO finish machined and ready to assemble?

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Mark J.
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63.29.25.168 under bore
No score for this post December 20 2001, 10:11 PM

They come under bore so you have to do serious boring which adds to the cost. As long as the H.P. is at a reasonable level stock block & crank should be O.K. but toss the rods for aftermarket.
Later,
Mark J.

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Brad
(no login)
216.106.37.21 stock crank
No score for this post December 20 2001, 10:26 PM

the stock crank makes me a little nervous. It has worked good for me so far, but I dont want to build a new motor(looking for round 900hp N/A) only to have a crank failure and stop all the fun. what kind of cranks have you been using at that level? how bout the "cast steel" cranks, any knowledge? still dont know whether to trust those or not. :eek:/

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Anonymous
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63.29.25.168 L. A. Billet
No score for this post December 20 2001, 11:02 PM

After 2 offset Stock cranks 1 forged unit done by Crankshaft Specialist ( all in the junk pile now) I chose to go with somethink I thought would last a long long time, L.A. Billet. Center counter weights and A BBC snout.
The cast steel unit is better than stock & should help you sleep better without having to get a second job to pay for your addiction.
Later,
Mark J.

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Brad
(no login)
216.106.37.24 thanxs for reply n/m
No score for this post December 21 2001, 7:04 PM

n/m

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Bret
(no login)
208.31.189.209 Cranks/nightmare
No score for this post December 29 2001, 10:38 PM

I had Crankshaft Specialists work over a steel truck crank for me. It was a nightmare of broken promises, shipping to and fro. Aaaahhhh.

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Dave McLain
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216.229.73.92 Engine System caps, Dove-A block
No score for this post December 31 2001, 4:14 PM

We use a DOVE -A Block with the engine systems caps on 2-3+4 with great results on our 557 engine. The block is 4.440 bore filed to the bottom of the water pump holes with Hard Block. We use a Crower crank in this engine with no problems and BME 6.700 Aluminum rods and Venolia pistons. The engine makes around 1100 HP with the 8:71 10% overdriven allowed in the Monster Truck rules and has been very very good. I'm in the process of building a 572 incher to replace the 557 for larger outdoor and Pro MT races and I'm going to use the new Motorsport Block, it's a very nice piece. This time around we're using a Bryant crank too, both having 4.5 stroke.

We do use cranks with the Boss snout lenght and I would recommend that if at all possible, I think it's much better.
 
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