I bought a set and will give them a try on my 472 as soon as time allows, should make a decent "street" head
As Scott has plainly said ... Castings are good and assembled heads, (unless done from bare castings and good parts), leave a lot to be desired. These are NOT an inexpensive race type cylinder head and shouldn't be though-of as such.This is a pretty old thread. I have since discovered much additional information about wet flow, intake port flow bias being incorrect, etc etc. I am going to need to transfer some of the information in other threads I have posted information on to this thread. The original positive feelings i had about these castings have been tempered by the quality of flow issues, odd wet flow characteristics and poor flow bias discovered in the poorly engineered intake port.
Peter Ken the owner of procomp whom I had spoken with on a number of occasions at the time I originally posted this had a chance to make a really good cylinder head however he did not.
I will add to this as time allows...
For all who read this remember:
The PC castings is a decent replacement casting in aluminum for the D3 head.
It is NOT a high performance head like the TFS street nor is it a replacement for said TFS street.
The casting itself is actually quite good though the valve job, cheap parts and poor assembly technique that procomp utilised make the assembled castings a no go in my opinion. Most of the ebay versions of these castings are crap in my opinion. They are cheaply assembled and misrepresented.
If Randy Malick, myself or others here outfit the castings with good parts, add a good valve job, do some minor port work and what not they are not a bad head for say under 550 HP applications however in fully ported max effort trim they are lucky to be 5% better than a max effort pair of D0VE's. Again this is a quality of intake flow issue.
I will and hope Randy will entertain reasonable questions about these castings in this thread. I will not put up with any unnecessary bashing, BS or trouble making here. With that being said I hope we can give an honest asessment of them and put this constant sore spot to rest...
The intake port works somewhat similar to a D3 ... they actually have their highest inner-port velocities in a different part of the port than a D3 but, they flow pretty much the same.What if they were used in a boosted application? That would sure improve the intake side of things. I don't need a max effort naturally aspirated head since I already have a Vortech YSI I would like to use with these. So what is anybody's thought on this?
In fully ported large valve form the pro comp exhaust port is quite good IMO. It is quiet and moves 245 cfm or more depending on level of port modification. Since a large exhaust port is a good idea in forced induction excepting turbo charging I feel that the exhaust port is up to the task.
Given the improper flow bias of the intake toward the center of the cylinder instead of the chamber wall I feel that any work done to mitigate this along with some port work to get the flow rates to the 340 cfm the heads are capable of at .600" lift would go along way toward making them suitable for a boosted application. The additional mixture motion imparted due to a boosted intake tract would help mitigate the less than ideal flow characteristics of the intake port as well.
I do not see why 1000 or 1200 HP is out of the question with good port work proper outfitting etc. Because of the better exhaust port i feel that they would offer an advantange over iron in a boosted application over and above the fact that they are aluminum.
These things are cheap. Buy one bare casting from procomp...... would you happen to have one of these castings that would be suitable as a work piece ?? ... i wouldn't even mind one that was cut in half if you have it ?? ...
... i'd like to spend some time on one of these, depending on what i can do with them, i'd like to test them on our dyno, we have a 470c.i. truck pull engine going together, (the SF-902 hasn't seen a big Ford in awhile) ... but we do get a lot of questions locally about them, thats why i ask ...
They come out of the box machined for studs and guideplates; Save about 70 pounds.Any one running these heads on the street? Real world seat of the pants feel? how much weight do the heads save vs d3s? Do they come set up for stamp rockers or roller rockers? I may buy some this weekend.
I am currently having a motor built for my Wife 71 Mach 1 in North Ft Myers Florida at an Outfit called MotorPLex. They plan on using pro comp heads thea i was a little leary about at first. They say that they are going to use pro comp CNC castings and use a kit that pro comp makes from springs to valve covers taht they will install and set tolerances the build will be to achieve 500 hp and they will dyno at completion all for 6 k i provided the 73 block,crank,edelbrck manifold,77o cfm carb. Any thoughts on the heads it does not sound as if they plan on doing any machine work to the castings thanks marcReceived my first order of the BBF and 351 C castings from Pro Comp today.
All in all not too bad considering the price.
The as delivered valve job is a 2 angle exhaust and 3 angle intake with 2.08"/1.65" valve sizes. The intake seat ID is too small for the head size and this hurts flow. The seat inserts are plenty big enough for 2.19"/1.76" valves.
As Randy stated the intake ports are Dove copies and the exhaust are a modified TFS copy that is purposely left small. The exhaust port location and height are as the TFS streets are.
There is a bunch of metal in these castings that does not need to be there. The wall thickness is such that making the ports larger is not a problem. I feel that this was intended to avoid patent infringement issues
These castings beat the as cast D3's on both the intake and exhaust when flowed with stock valves on the as delivered valve job.
When the bowls are blended and the intake seat ID addressed the castings beat the budget small valve D3's. Once lift exceeds .600" the intake ports get ugly just like the SCJ's do. They do however have strong flow numbers until .600" lift. This is really appropriate for a street head.
I do not see these castings producing the high lift numbers that the TFS streets do although they give them a good run till .400" even with the small valves. The flow numbers I have are with minimal work and the as delivered seats. I believe that the numbers will be better with my seat cutters and more extensive short turn radii work.
It looks like they will be a good replacement for the budget small valve iron castings even in a entry level budget version priced just above $1K.
Flow rates 1.65" exhaust:
As delivered / Bowl blended / Budget D3
56 / 62 / 58
99 / 105 / 108
138 / 139 / 137
159 / 162 / 155
172 / 178 / 170
182 / 189 / 180
183 / 196 /
184 / 200 /
Flow rates 2.08" intake"
75 / 74 / 78
147 / 150 / 150
211/ /211 / 211
257 / 264 / 258
270 / 290 / 287
290 / 299 / 306
I see some modest improvements coming with a better valve seat and more short turn radii work on the intake side and there seems to be about another 20 cfm exhaust available with a more agressive short turn shape again with the small valves.
To be honest I do not see the intakes surpassing the large valve iron stuff by much but the exhaust should be some 225 cfm or better. There is enough meat to make the exhaust port large enough to mimick the TFS exhaust port.
R&D is coming for a large valve fully ported version. I will update as more information becomes available.
For availability and cost information see post in the auction section.
Link to Pics: http://www.reincarnation-automotive.com/ProCompBBFCastingsIndex.html
The castings are quite good but, I certainly would NOT use the trash Pro Comp kit of parts.They say that they are going to use pro comp CNC castings and use a kit that pro comp makes from springs to valve covers that they will install and set tolerances.
They have my motor and a 2500$ deposit is it possible to build it for 6k get 500 hp for that w /quality parts if so what direction should i ask them to take.Thanks for the help MarcThe castings are quite good but, I certainly would NOT use the trash Pro Comp kit of parts.
The seat and valve guide machine work from Pro Comp leaves a lot to be desired.
This is just a tip ... it is your engine.,