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New to the forum. I've owned my 86 250 for 3 years. Previous owner, a racer, built the 460 engine with a moderate performance cam & put a timing gear set in it. The idler gear arms that hold them against the cam & crankshaft gears broke. Broke a chunk out of the cover too. Long story short, can I go back to the chain? The cam & crank gears I compared them to at the parts store to the gear set are noticably smaller. Is the another solution you can suggest?
 

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New to the forum. I've owned my 86 250 for 3 years. Previous owner, a racer, built the 460 engine with a moderate performance cam & put a timing gear set in it. The idler gear arms that hold them against the cam & crankshaft gears broke. Broke a chunk out of the cover too. Long story short, can I go back to the chain? The cam & crank gears I compared them to at the parts store to the gear set are noticably smaller. Is the another solution you can suggest?

Switch back to a quality straight up double roller timing set. New front covers are easily sourced. We do it for many of our crate builds.



SJ
used 2b RHP


:D
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thanks for the quick response. But I'm not familiar with the "double roller". Is that a type of chain? And does it need the same number of teeth as the gear set cam & crank shaft?
 

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Thanks for the quick response. But I'm not familiar with the "double roller". Is that a type of chain? And does it need the same number of teeth as the gear set cam & crank shaft?

The number of teeth on a double roller vs the teeth on a gear to gear is not material.

The ratio of 2 to 1 however is.




Here is a pic of a good double roller set. Think two rows of bicycle like chain.









SJ
used 2b RHP



:D
 

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HI, yes what Mad said.. its one chain that looks like two chains connected together. Just get a multi or 0* set and set the timing to 0* on the crank.
good luck
tim
 

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Lets keep it simple: Ask for a timing chain set for a 68-71 429. That is the easiest way to make sure you get a "straight up" timing chain set. If you get one for a '72 and later 460, the cam timing will be retarded. As was stated, the number of teeth doesn't matter, just that the cam gear has twice as many as the crank gear. This will not be anything you need to concern yourself with when you buy your timing set, as every 4 stroke engine works on this principle and the gears and chains are matched as such. Last I checked you can still get a new timing cover straight from Ford, but places like Summit Racing and Jegs sell them as well.
 

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Lets keep it simple: Ask for a timing chain set for a 68-71 429. That is the easiest way to make sure you get a "straight up" timing chain set. If you get one for a '72 and later 460, the cam timing will be retarded. As was stated, the number of teeth doesn't matter, just that the cam gear has twice as many as the crank gear. This will not be anything you need to concern yourself with when you buy your timing set, as every 4 stroke engine works on this principle and the gears and chains are matched as such. Last I checked you can still get a new timing cover straight from Ford, but places like Summit Racing and Jegs sell them as well.

Not all "early" timing sets sold are actual early straight up. Something to be aware of.



SJ
used 2b RHP


:D
 

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Just recently installed the straight timing set in my 86 RV, I ordered 2 sets through my local NAPA dealer, one for a 1969 429 and the other one for a 1995 FI 460. Both sets were straight up. Decided to installed the one for the 1995 FI 460 since it was a double roller and seemed to be of high quality.
 

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Just recently installed the straight timing set in my 86 RV, I ordered 2 sets through my local NAPA dealer, one for a 1969 429 and the other one for a 1995 FI 460. Both sets were straight up. Decided to installed the one for the 1995 FI 460 since it was a double roller and seemed to be of high quality.








NOT SO FAST,WAS THE LATER A DOUBLE ROW? OR DOUBLE ROLLER? theres a big diff ,and yes late model 460s were straight up
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Just installed the cam & crank gears on the new double roller chain set. Two things I need help with. 1. The dot on the crank gear is half a tooth to the left of the keyway. Do I align the dots or the key with the dot on the cam gear? 2. The crank gear does not align with the cam gear. It seems the cam gear needs a spacer behind it like the old gear I took off had. It looks like it needs to be the thickness of one row. The problem trying to use the old one is that it doesn't fit snug on the collar. Do I have the wrong parts you think? I'm not sure what year the engine is.
 

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Just installed the cam & crank gears on the new double roller chain set. Two things I need help with. 1. The dot on the crank gear is half a tooth to the left of the keyway. Do I align the dots or the key with the dot on the cam gear? 2. The crank gear does not align with the cam gear. It seems the cam gear needs a spacer behind it like the old gear I took off had. It looks like it needs to be the thickness of one row. The problem trying to use the old one is that it doesn't fit snug on the collar. Do I have the wrong parts you think? I'm not sure what year the engine is.


thats because its a 1972 and up set, thats a retarded gear set, dot and keyway must line up to be a straight up set
 

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can you shoot a pict of what you go going on Please?
good luck
tim
 

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This is what I was referring to.

"True" straight up has the crank gears tooth, dot and the key way all EXACTLY AT NOON.

When the keyway is clockwise 1/2 tooth the set is retarded.




This link will show the difference.



Timing-rear-comparison-index


Ignore the following on that particular page:

It has been my experience that when using an early timing set on a later
model vehicle with the smog cam that the low end response is improved
but the high end HP suffers as the power band is moved down some 500
RPM. The specs on the smogger cam were changed to accomodate the
retarded timing set. Always use the early timing set when changing cams



The cam specs were NOT CHANGED.



SJ
used 2b RHP



:D
 

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Discussion Starter #17
It's the late crank sprocket I installed today. So, if I understand correctly, I need to align the crank key with the cam gear dot??
 

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Hay.. What is the gear looking thing against the block behind the cam gear? I think the crank gear floats a little (in or out to line up the the cam gear)? just at first turn or to help aline . Cam gear would be dot out and cam pin in the hole.
good luck
tim
 

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It's the late crank sprocket I installed today. So, if I understand correctly, I need to align the crank key with the cam gear dot??

As shown in the link.

Crank gear tooth, dot and keyway at NOON.

Wrong timing set.




SJ
used 2b RHP



:D
 

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Discussion Starter #20
I believe those marks are from the previous gear set that came apart. That crank gear I put on is tight & cannot float. I know those marks look like another row of gear sprocket.
 
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