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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
So I have a mid 70s 460 and I am noticing with my timing light my timing was out of place so I adjusted the HB to 0 degrees on compression stroke and distributor pointed to number 1 cylinder. I unplugged the vacuum advanced as I heard I was supposed to do for messing with timing and started the car, ran like booty at about 600 RPM and I checked timing. Before I readjusted, it ran okay with a slight roughness at about 1000 rpm without kicking the choke off but very very lean as with it running preadjustment the balancer showed as far above 0 degrees as the timing marks went. After Adjustment, the pointer was not on the timing marks anymore with ATC above the pointer. Does this mean my timing chain is bad and needs to be replaced? I am kinda assuming this already but I always want second thoughts on such important things as timing and a big job such as this. Please and thank you!
 

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If the engine has the same cam gear as it was originally built with, that gear should be changed anyway. It's nylon teeth can "shred" and make a big mess.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
If the engine has the same cam gear as it was originally built with, that gear should be changed anyway. It's nylon teeth can "shred" and make a big mess.
Ive heard of that, but I wanted to double check what people think this could be and if I could try something else instead of such a big job
 

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HI, WAIT...... The idle RPM should be 650 with a manule and 750 with an automatic in "N"... Timing should be at like 10* to 12* Before TDC ... AT idle .. If the Chain/gears are bad the timing mark well move around while you watch it at idle.. If it does NOT move around While you watch it at idle the chain is OK...

Good luck
tim
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
HI, WAIT...... The idle RPM should be 650 with a manule and 750 with an automatic in "N"... Timing should be at like 10* to 12* Before TDC ... AT idle .. If the Chain/gears are bad the timing mark well move around while you watch it at idle.. If it does NOT move around While you watch it at idle the chain is OK...

Good luck
tim
The engine died to quick for me to see if it was really jumping, but I put the balancer at 0 degrees on the compression stroke for number 1 and put the distributor pointing to number 1 and started it and it immediately began running like butt and the balancer showed it was not even at the timing marks right away with ATC above the pointer. So I am not sure what to check or do from here besides thinking its a bad chain and bad nylon teeth
 

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HI, There is no way you can accuraitly set the timing by just putting the damnpner on 0 and the rotor pointing at (what you think is exactlly the #1 spot.. it takes very little movement of the distributor to move the timing a lot... What you have now it a close enough to start but not right ... You have to use the light at the RPM's I mentioned earlier.. if it keeps dying try and keep the rpms up so it stays running.. and move the distributor a little eather way and see if it starts to clear up or have a light on it and make the proper adjustment..
Secondly are your sure you are at the proper TDC... and your arn't 180* out , They well run but run verrrrrry bad..
TDC Comes up Twice to ONE revolution of the distributor.
Have your changed anything from the last time you drove it???? IE. Carb, timing chain , Distributor..??

Good luck
tim
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
HI, There is no way you can accuraitly set the timing by just putting the damnpner on 0 and the rotor pointing at (what you think is exactlly the #1 spot.. it takes very little movement of the distributor to move the timing a lot... What you have now it a close enough to start but not right ... You have to use the light at the RPM's I mentioned earlier.. if it keeps dying try and keep the rpms up so it stays running.. and move the distributor a little eather way and see if it starts to clear up or have a light on it and make the proper adjustment..
Secondly are your sure you are at the proper TDC... and your arn't 180* out , They well run but run verrrrrry bad..
TDC Comes up Twice to ONE revolution of the distributor.
Have your changed anything from the last time you drove it???? IE. Carb, timing chain , Distributor..??

Good luck
tim
Ive redone the timing a few times because I just cant seem to get it right, Ive always had help before so on my own is tricky. I was always told to set to TDC then point to number 1 and adjust from there and when I said it ran well before, i didnt change the position of the distributor much from where it was if at all after I realigned to 0 degrees when it started running like ****
 

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HI, Like I said,, What you have done is just enough to get it to start,,,
Now you have to use the light to SET the timing.. NOT pull the distributor but turn it one way or the other , go with which ever way makes it run better and brings the timing to the proper setting..
The motor HAS to be running to set the timing correctly and you have to use the light .. If you may have to work the throttle to keep it running while you set it till it runs on its own,.,.
 

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HI Again... Now at the very first of your first post you said that the timing was out of adjustment.. At that point all you would have had to do was put your timing light on it .. "loosen" the distributor bolt and while the motor is running TURN the distributor one way or the other while you watch the mark to bring it into specs.

Instead you went and moved something around now its really out of specs..

Now how did you check that your were at TDC of the compression stroke? its easy to be off on that..
The TDC 0* mark comes up twice for every one revolution/turn of the distributor. Once for TDC of the Exhaust stroke and once for the TDC of the Compression stroke..

good luck
tim
 

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Every 90* turn of the crank one of the pistons is firing and it takes 8 90* movements of the the crank to make one complete revolution of the motor, so the Cranks turns twice to every ONE compleat cycle of the motor ... From #1 firing to the next time it fires the crank turns twice (2 times).
4 stroke motor
1) piston up.. compression
2) piston down.. power
3) piston up.. exhaust
4) piston down.. intake of fuel
then back to (1)
good luck
tim
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Every 90* turn of the crank one of the pistons is firing and it takes 8 90* movements of the the crank to make one complete revolution of the motor, so the Cranks turns twice to every ONE compleat cycle of the motor ... From #1 firing to the next time it fires the crank turns twice (2 times).
4 stroke motor
1) piston up.. compression
2) piston down.. power
3) piston up.. exhaust
4) piston down.. intake of fuel
then back to (1)
good luck
tim
I had put a paper towel in the plug hole and kept turning the engine till it popped out hard, then I put it to 0°
 

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Did you turn it by hand or use the starter? using the starter it is very easy to over run the mark.. If it was running before you worked on it, You shouldn't have had to move any of the wires in the distributor or move the rotor to point to #1.. turning it by hand is the best way to find TDC of the compression stroke..
Because of cam over lap in some cam's you can get some compression on the start of the exhaust...
Did you move the wires in the distributor? did you pull the distributor and move it that way?
good luck
Tim
 

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A great way to check the timing chain for stretch without getting too involved is to pull the distributor cap, and turn the motor over by hand back and forth. If you turn the crank CW a few degrees and then turn it back CCW and the distributor rotor doesn't move, the chain is potentially stretched. Could be the distributor gear as well.

Anyway, I'm a little confused why you fiddled with timing to begin with, perhaps I misread. It was running fine before hand, or no?
 

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did you plug the vacuum source after unplugging the advance? you will never get it to run right until you eliminate any vacuum leaks.

jim
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
A great way to check the timing chain for stretch without getting too involved is to pull the distributor cap, and turn the motor over by hand back and forth. If you turn the crank CW a few degrees and then turn it back CCW and the distributor rotor doesn't move, the chain is potentially stretched. Could be the distributor gear as well.

Anyway, I'm a little confused why you fiddled with timing to begin with, perhaps I misread. It was running fine before hand, or no?
I had just installed the motor after buying it from someone else and had things taken out while replacing parts so it was never right to begin with
 

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I had just installed the motor after buying it from someone else and had things taken out while replacing parts so it was never right to begin with
Yikes. Sounds like it might be a good idea to check everything.

What parts were all replaced? What's your feeling about the skill level of the individual who was replacing parts?
 

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Hi Thug, in your first post you said it was running but the timing was not right... Then you movecd something around at the distributor.. If you can put it back like it was when it was running .. we may have a better chance to get it running... REMEMBER The crank turns twice to one turn of the distributor,, one time at TDC the rotor in the distributor it may be pointing 180* out (pointing the opposite direction) and the next time you rotate it to TDC it should be pointing at number 1 position..You may be 180* out not know what you changed and by how much..
good luck
tim
 

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HI Yeah.. So I don't think we well hear back from him on this .... I just went thru a few of the posts he's started, like 5 of them .. and he hasn't returned to any of them to finish them out... some 7+ months old from the last post..
In one he's put 100's of seals in a 460???
Good luck to him if he is legit..
Tim
 

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HI Yeah.. So I don't think we well hear back from him on this .... I just went thru a few of the posts he's started, like 5 of them .. and he hasn't returned to any of them to finish them out... some 7+ months old from the last post..
In one he's put 100's of seals in a 460???
Good luck to him if he is legit..
Tim
Bummer. Well, I guess at least he's keeping national seal in business.
 
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