It shouldn't be an issue, especially being driven on the street with lower than say, 6,000 RPM. I bought and I'm putting together a Probe Industries 525 stroker (which is actually a 527) 10:4:1 compression. Solid roller cam with stacked EFI. I would suggest the 521 kit, so everything works together.

 

Thanks, would the Eagle Specialty Products 15011030 be a better choice for my application? This makes it a 521 and has the flat top pistons with +3.00cc head volume. Compression ratio would be around 10:1.

 

Get your stroker kit from one of the guys on here. I've got Scat/Probe Industries 4.5" stroke 552" in a 2 bolt C9 block in my Mach 1 that I've been driving for years. No issues whatsoever. I'd message Mark O'neal myself. Here's his profile:

Mark O'Neal

www.460ford.com

 

Just FYI the Edelbrock heads are just an aluminum version of a factory cast Ford head which means there’s a lot more modern heads out there for similar $$.

You say a street heavy car application. What fuel are you gonna use? what gear ratio?what transmission?

 

The choice of fuel around here, Netherlands, is pretty wide. Can get 98 octane, ethanol free and even 100 octane ethanol free.

The transmission is not yet figured out. Rebuild a C6, maybe adding an overdrive, or go with a E4OD and do some fabrication on the tunnel.

Gear ration is 2.70, 9 3/8 rear end.

 

For the same $$$'s you can get AFR's and make an additional 50 to 70+ hp in the 600 hp window.

Running flat tops with a 4.3" stroke crank and large chamber castings places static c/r at 10.8 to 1 at 0 deck with large chamber 95 cc heads. 11.3 to 1 with the 4.5" stroke.

We are direct MD with SCAT. I don't run eagle cranks since breaking them on several occasions.

A forged crank in your application is overkill. For anything 700 or less a cast crank is fine.






Scotty J. "AKA" The "Mad Porter"
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Ported BBF iron head specialist & Aluminum heads from all sources.
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Thanks, I'll go with a Scat kit with a 4.300 stroke, flat tops and 4.390 bore.

Any recommendations on which heads and cam to use to make a lot of power but keep it driveable? As stated, it won't be seeing a lot past 6000 rpm.

I'll start with the engine build. The transmission, rear end and other stuff will be changed as needed.

 

I like the 545. I do not have a particular reason for it, but I like it.

Scotty, what do you think of the combustion chamber on the 86cc AFR head...out of the box.

We all know none of us can leave well enough alone.

 

I doubt Scat has a piston for anything other than the factory valve location, outside of custom.

Cookie cutter kits....and all of that.

 

I know you know more than I do Mark, but scat kits with Mahle pistons can be had with all different flycuts for Cobra heads, Kasse etc. I looked at a Mahle catalogue and they listed a bunch of stroker pistons with asterisks alluding to different head manufacturers. Now covid could have changed a bunch of stuff but I know they did as of 2019.

 

Mahle has a piston that covers the SCJ / P51 and works with the AFR castings as well.
This is the std shelf brand used for the BBF kits.

Flat top or 38 cc dish.

When I need a different dish volume I have a proprietary line of AFR pistons available via Racetec.


Cubic Bore Stroke Rod Comp Pin Crown Wght Alloy Assembly Old
Inches Height Diam. Vol G Meas. Min Max Part No. Part No.
Compression Clearance Guide
Ratio
BIG BLOCK FORD for the SCJ, KAASE P-51®, AFR 14° BULLIT CYLINDER HEADS
1.5, 1.5, 3.0mm File Fit Performance Ring Set included 72cc 80cc 84cc
503 4.390 4.150 6.700 1.525 0.990 -28cc 591 10.4 9.7 9.4 4032 0.235 0.0041 0.0049 930261990
514 4.440 610 930261940
503 4.390 -3cc TBD 13.1 12.1 11.6 2618 0.235 0.0061 0.0069 930261790
514 4.440 TBD 13.3 12.3 11.8 930261740
520 4.390 4.300 6.800 1.350 0.990 -38cc 564 10.3 9.7 9.5 4032 0.235 0.0041 0.0049 930245690 BBF350390I38
532 4.440 585 10.5 9.9 9.7 930245640 BBF350440I38
520 4.390 -3cc TBD 13.4 12.3 11.9 2618 0.235 0.0061 0.0069 930261890
532 4.440 TBD 13.7 12.6 12.1 930261840
545 4.390 4.500 6.700 1.350 0.990 -38cc 564 10.3 9.7 9.5 4032 0.235 0.0041 0.0049 930245690 BBF350390I38
557 4.440 585 10.5 9.9 9.7 930245640 BBF350440I38
545 4.390 -3cc TBD 14.2 13.0 12.5 2618 0.235 0.0061 0.0069 930261890
557 4.440 TBD 14.5 13.3 12.8 930261840


Page 17 of the 2018 Mahle application guide.





Scotty J. "AKA" The "Mad Porter"
"EMC 2006" 3rd place finisher
Ported BBF iron head specialist & Aluminum heads from all sources.
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See our products in the Vendor for sale section
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ParklandAutoMachine.com
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Parkland Auto Machine

 

Mahle has a piston that covers the SCJ / P51 and works with the AFR castings as well.
This is the std shelf brand used for the BBF kits.

Flat top or 38 cc dish.

When I need a different dish volume I have a proprietary line of AFR pistons available via Racetec.


Cubic Bore Stroke Rod Comp Pin Crown Wght Alloy Assembly Old
Inches Height Diam. Vol G Meas. Min Max Part No. Part No.
Compression Clearance Guide
Ratio
BIG BLOCK FORD for the SCJ, KAASE P-51®, AFR 14° BULLIT CYLINDER HEADS
1.5, 1.5, 3.0mm File Fit Performance Ring Set included 72cc 80cc 84cc
503 4.390 4.150 6.700 1.525 0.990 -28cc 591 10.4 9.7 9.4 4032 0.235 0.0041 0.0049 930261990
514 4.440 610 930261940
503 4.390 -3cc TBD 13.1 12.1 11.6 2618 0.235 0.0061 0.0069 930261790
514 4.440 TBD 13.3 12.3 11.8 930261740
520 4.390 4.300 6.800 1.350 0.990 -38cc 564 10.3 9.7 9.5 4032 0.235 0.0041 0.0049 930245690 BBF350390I38
532 4.440 585 10.5 9.9 9.7 930245640 BBF350440I38
520 4.390 -3cc TBD 13.4 12.3 11.9 2618 0.235 0.0061 0.0069 930261890
532 4.440 TBD 13.7 12.6 12.1 930261840
545 4.390 4.500 6.700 1.350 0.990 -38cc 564 10.3 9.7 9.5 4032 0.235 0.0041 0.0049 930245690 BBF350390I38
557 4.440 585 10.5 9.9 9.7 930245640 BBF350440I38
545 4.390 -3cc TBD 14.2 13.0 12.5 2618 0.235 0.0061 0.0069 930261890
557 4.440 TBD 14.5 13.3 12.8 930261840

That's gotta be on gorpy valve relief......

I did it once. Won't do it again.

 

Look at Ohio Crankshaft. Ohio Crankshaft - Over 1,200 Crankshafts In Stock

I'm using one of their 502" stroker kits. All forged, 4.150" crankshaft, 6.7" H-beam rods, SRP pistons, Total Seal rings, King bearings. Everything mic'd out perfectly. I just got the engine installed on my test stand. Hopefully run it soon.

 

I see you had it cat scanned.

Can we see a copy of the lab report?

 

Were you a comedian in another life Mark?









Scotty J. "AKA" The "Mad Porter"
"EMC 2006" 3rd place finisher
Ported BBF iron head specialist & Aluminum heads from all sources.
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Alright, so I thought about it for a few days. But if I'm correct my possible valve to piston clearance issues would be over if I'd use +38cc dished pistons, right? Only problem with dished pistons is my cr is dropping to about 9.3:1, with 74cc heads and 4.300 stroke.

Could get the cr a bit higher with some decking work done, and using some thinner head gasket. This way, the AFR or TrickFlow heads would fit without a doubt. Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

Alright, so I thought about it for a few days. But if I'm correct my possible valve to piston clearance issues would be over if I'd use +38cc dished pistons, right? Only problem with dished pistons is my cr is dropping to about 9.3:1, with 74cc heads and 4.300 stroke.

Could get the cr a bit higher with some decking work done, and using some thinner head gasket. This way, the AFR or TrickFlow heads would fit without a doubt. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Compression Ratio Calculator

ENTER YOUR DATA	CALCULATED DATA
Cylinder Head Volume (cc)		Cylinder Head Vol (cubic in.)	4.514
Piston Head Volume (cc)		Piston Head Vol (cubic in.)	2.318
Gasket Thickness (in.)		Swept Volume (cubic in.)	65.086
Gasket Bore (in.)		T.D.C. Volume (cubic in.)	7.484
Cylinder Bore Diameter (in.)		Gasket Volume (cubic in.)	0.652
Deck Clearance (in.) Note: Neg. number above deck, Pos. number below deck		Deck Volume (cubic in.)	0.000
Stroke (in.)		STATIC COMPRESSION RATIO	9.697

A bit of decking off of the heads gets it closer to 10 to 1.

My SCAT rep stated yesterday that Mahle is expected to have the dished stroker pistons available in about 3 weeks.

Scotty J. "AKA" The "Mad Porter"
"EMC 2006" 3rd place finisher
Ported BBF iron head specialist & Aluminum heads from all sources.
Custom ground cams
See our products in the Vendor for sale section
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What makes you think I know more than you do? Mahle is such a disagreeable company to deal with that I pretty much pretend they don't exist. I have no idea, and do not care, what they have.

Ergo....you know more than I do.

 

Well, I always thought you knew more than I do... bee'n u r a piss ton man u fact er. Reminds me of the guy who said he was an injuneer, just didn't know how to spell it.

It seems Mahle may have pissed on your campfire once or twice.

 

Alright, getting closwr. I did some calculations and sent some e-mails to different manufacturers and came up with this setup:

521 stroker
Scat crank, 4.390 bore 4.300 stroke
Flat top pistons, +6cc valve reliefs
6.800 H beam rods
10.6:1 cr

TFS 78cc heads,
325cc intake runner, 145cc exhaust runner
2.250 intake valve, 1.760 exhaust valve
CNC ported
Headers

Lunati hydraulic flat tappet cam
295/305
245/255@0.050
.615/.622
LSA/ICL: 110/106

Edelbrock RPM air gap intake
Edelbrock 800CFM AVS2 carb

Anybody an idea what kind of power/torque this setup would make on premium pump gas? Should I change anything?

 

Alright, getting closwr. I did some calculations and sent some e-mails to different manufacturers and came up with this setup:

521 stroker
Scat crank, 4.390 bore 4.300 stroke
Flat top pistons, +6cc valve reliefs
6.800 H beam rods
10.6:1 cr

TFS 78cc heads,
325cc intake runner, 145cc exhaust runner
2.250 intake valve, 1.760 exhaust valve
CNC ported
Headers

Lunati hydraulic flat tappet cam
295/305
245/255@0.050
.615/.622
LSA/ICL: 110/106

Edelbrock RPM air gap intake
Edelbrock 800CFM AVS2 carb

Anybody an idea what kind of power/torque this setup would make on premium pump gas? Should I change anything?

It's a 12.0:1 motor with the wrong cam, wrong heads, wrong manifold and an Edelbrock carb (where horsepower goes to die)

I have no idea how much power it will make, but it will detonate itself to death on the first tank of 91.

 

Just my opinion and that ain't worth 2 cents. Those cam specs looks like one of those thumper or bootlegger cams that end up sacrificing bottom end torque for a lumping exhaust sound. I think those heads ports are too large and lazy. Valves size is right but the ports are slow.

Scott or Mark would know better but just glancing at the flat tops and 78cc heads it would be more than 10.6 unless you deep in the hole. Five to 10 in the hole and a head gasket to match to keep around 0.050 quench space will make it more pump gas friendly.

Unless you have ever done extensive tuning on old quadrajet carbs before I wouldn't recommend the Edelbrock carbs. Holley style carbs are much easier for a novice tuner.

 

Back to the drawing board. AFR recommended to go with the 280cc runner heads. That would most likely be the 85cc ones, right?

So without decking and the right gasket, that would put it at 10.5:1 cr. Or would it be better to deck it and go with dished pistons?

So let's scrap this cam. What would you recommend on cam specs?

 

The 85cc head will get you to 11.5 at .010 deck with a .040 x 4.500 gasket. I don't know if the octane ratings over there are Imperial or Metric (that's "humor"), so I don't really know what you can get away with.

You need to stop guessing and mosey on up to someone that knows what they're doing. The trick is getting all the parts to work together, preferably in the same rpm range. You must go with dished pistons if you want 10.2:1.

 

Another vote to 'pick a knowledgeable vendor' and leverage their extensive experience. Cheaper to get the right combo the first time with help from a pro.

 

I nominate Scotty.......

 

Best thing I did when I started to build my first 385 stroker was sit on the phone for an hour or two with A) The guy I got the stroker kit from, and B) the guy I got my custom cam from. Not the same guy and they've both posted on this thread and both have been suggested for you to contact. Do it, be done, and be happy without any guesswork.

 

As I get older I try to lean towards the “buy once cry once” philosophy.
My suggestion is still to find some one knowledgeable enough to build you a shortblock or long block and have it shipped.

 

If you haven't already bought stuff, I have a 545 for sale. Used a stroker kit I got on this site with dished pistons for 10.5:1 compression, ported D0VE heads, 260 duration/650 lift roller, etc. Ran 6.70's @ 101 and 10:60's at 127 in an 87 Mustang that was stock body, stock suspension, street legal. Sold the car as a roller and want $3500 for the engine.

 

Well, thank you all very much for great advice, really appreciate the amount of knowledge on this site. After e-mailing back and forth with Scott, I happened to find a brand new 521 stroker build for sale not so far from my hometown. Seems like its in the right direction with quality parts, suggested by many of you. Decided to buy this one, and finish it myself. For those who are interested, here are the specs:


4.390 bore
4.300 stroke
Scat forged steel crank
Mahle -38cc dish pistons, made for AFR bullits
Forged steel H-beam rods, 6.800
Internally balanced

AFR 280cc 75cc cylinder heads

Voodoo cam hydraulic flat tappet:
adv. dur. 268/276
227/233 @.050
552/564 lift

Steel Roller Rockers

No intake yet
No carb yet
No ignition yet

Around 9.3:1 C/R, so should be pumpgas friendly

If anyone has a suggestion for an intake and carb or to change anything, feel free to comment.

 

Should be a good one in your Lincoln. Cam should provide great torque with the stroker for that big beast. I'd give it a Torker II and an 850 double pumper to fit under your hood since you're not building a race car, a set of headers, and whatever ignition system you prefer, myself. It'll blow the tires off with ease.

 

If you don't want to poke a hole through the hood go with the Torker II. I have two Mark III's and went round and round on what size stroker to stuff in it, went with Scotty J. for parts and input. 545, AFR 280 75cc heads, comp roller rockers, custom cam from Scott 227-241 113 Kaase oil pump, Canton road racing pan, FPA headers, 3" exhaust from headers to tail, Extreme mufflers and Vibrant resonators at rear. Torker II with Holley XFlow EFI with the Hyper spark distributor with timing control. Block squared and zero decked .041 head gaskets.

C6 rebuilt with parts from Broader performance, torque converter from Broader spec'd to the engine. 9" Detroit Truetrac 3.25 gears out back ( check axle length, if I remember correctly I had to get a 5/8" longer axle for driver side). Your stock rear end is a 9-3/8" the (9" bolts right in but the offset is a bit different hence the axle change). There is a template for setting axle length that any good diff shop can help with. This motor is docile to drive around until I hit the go pedal, smoke show on demand then big smile ensues. The largest tire that can be put on without rubbing or rolling the quarters is 245 or you can mini tub it like another guy did and get some larger drag radials on it lol. He has his Mark III in the 9's at the track.

I highly recommend in tank fuel pump if you go EFI, it can be done with the stock fuel tank, which I would absolutely replace if it hasn't been already (all three of the Mark III's I've owned had to have the tank replaced due to rust) I know I've missed some details and more than happy to answer questions.

Dan

 

Just saw that this thread is at least three years old and dude is likely long gone and done with the build.

 

No stroker. Just find C9Ve or Dove heads. Deck n triangle valve job. 480 hp